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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:57 am 
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Skunky Woof wrote:
Trout Mask is a masterpiece. period. of course it's not everyone's cup of tea. i don't even think it is tea.

also, Unconditionally Guaranteed and Bluejeans & Moonbeams aren't terrible. i think the only reason people bag on those albums is because it was so different from the atonal avant garde CB everyone knows and sort-of loves. UG is actually one of my favorite Beefheart albums. it has some great tunes, and Lazy Music is a classic

This is all true - and well put. Anyone who disses UG and B&M is just repeating a tired old cliché. By any other artist, these two albums would have been bona fide Seventies classics. I actually think the "Tragic Band" B&M is the stronger of the two - but they're both highly enjoyable. Check out the 2006 remasters. - TMR is a bona fide Sixties classic, or of any period, of course.

By all accounts, the brand new Bat Chain Puller should be a great starting point for a Beefheart newbie!

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 5:14 am 
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Dark Clothes wrote:
By all accounts, the brand new Bat Chain Puller should be a great starting point for a Beefheart newbie!
Could it be that it won't work with a price tag like that? I'm holding out even though I'm not exactly qualified to call myself anything like a CB newbie: I have the box set! --

:P


Last edited by buffalo_voice on Fri Feb 24, 2012 8:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 5:48 am 
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thenoisydrum wrote:
Wen D. Carlos wrote:
Let's see...the typical moron's response to Trout Mask...

- it's unlistenable
- it's impossible to enjoy
- the band is just playing random notes
- there are no melodies
- there are no rhythms
- people only pretend to like it because it's "hip"
- people only pretend to like it because the guy from the Simpsons likes it

Have I missed any?


Yeah;

- people only pretend to like it because Zappa produced it


I've listened to it hundreds of times myself and fucking love it.


So if I love Zappa and Beefheart and don't care for the album 'Trout Mask Replica' overall - I'm a pussy, but as you pointed out noisydrum, I'm supposed to pretend to like it instead b/c FZ produced it. I'm confused. Please let me know how I'm supposed to feel. :roll:

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 6:39 am 
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i'm the same way, i don't like Troutmask (fuckin moron/pussy!) but i do happen to like Bluejeans and Unconditionally... :?

i guess i need to get my shit together :roll:

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:09 am 
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manichispanic wrote:
i'm the same way, i don't like Troutmask (fuckin moron/pussy!) but i do happen to like Bluejeans and Unconditionally... :?

i guess i need to get my shit together :roll:


Totally, manichi - get your opinions in order, Sir! :wink:

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 3:52 pm 
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Wen D. Carlos wrote:
LOL - I can't believe that Frank Zappa fans are still complaining about Trout Mask Replica being "unlistenable". What a bunch of fuckin' pussies.

HAHAHAHA! GREAT!


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:03 pm 
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Skunky Woof wrote:
Trout Mask is a masterpiece. period. of course it's not everyone's cup of tea. i don't even think it is tea.

also, Unconditionally Guaranteed and Bluejeans & Moonbeams aren't terrible. i think the only reason people bag on those albums is because it was so different from the atonal avant garde CB everyone knows and sort-of loves. UG is actually one of my favorite Beefheart albums. it has some great tunes, and Lazy Music is a classic

you could edit and combine songs from those two and make a respectable release. BJ&MB has 3 good tunes- Party of Special Things, Observatory Crest, and the title track. UG has maybe 5 tunes - still not enough for a real release, or as good as what was already there. CB had a tough time, as everyone does in the music biz, of "topping" himself. How do you follow up TMR? (OK, Decals was close)Every time the Stones release something, everyone wonders is it as good as Exile, SG, or Tattoo.
Every CB release is different. That is what I like - I don't know what I am getting, but I know it will be a different flavor - the man did not repeat himself. FZ (when he was alive_ was pretty much the same way = each release was a different animal, maybe some similarities, but again unique.)


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 5:28 pm 
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I finally got a shipping notice. I hope it gets here soon! I wanna hear it!

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 6:17 pm 
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Location: Pouting for you? Punky Meadows, pouting for you?!!
Hey Wendy, you should check your pyjamas, I'm sure I can smell something burning.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 1:58 am 
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PenguinInBondage wrote:
So if I love Zappa and Beefheart and don't care for the album 'Trout Mask Replica' overall - I'm a pussy, but as you pointed out noisydrum, I'm supposed to pretend to like it instead b/c FZ produced it. I'm confused. Please let me know how I'm supposed to feel. :roll:



I think that if you insert the cd deep into your rectum you will learn to appreciate it. It needs to be absorbed.

And here's a spirited defense of UG by Graham Johnston, founder of Beefheart.Com:

http://www.furious.com/perfect/beefhear ... nteed.html

Supposedly the MB Liked the tracks they recorded but were turned off the producers "sweetening" of them. I always thought the reformed MB should tackle a tune or 2 from the album, give 'em more balls, would be cool to hear.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 9:26 am 
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brainpang wrote:
I think that if you insert the cd deep into your rectum you will learn to appreciate it. It needs to be absorbed.


I have ripped the CD into my media library long ago so that's going to be a problem. Second, I'm not putting anything in my rectum (but plenty comes out!) Thanks for your opinion, I'll choose to ignore it. :roll:
That's the beauty of opinions, everyone has one! I'm sure there are plenty of albums I absolutely love that you hate: who the fuck cares?

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 9:29 am 
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I like Trout Mask just fine, but I've reeeeeeeaaaally got to be in the mood for it. Of all my Beefheart albums, it's probably the one that gets the fewest spins (I never bothered with BJ&MB or Unconditionally Guaranteed).


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 9:38 am 
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madcow1515 wrote:
I like Trout Mask just fine, but I've reeeeeeeaaaally got to be in the mood for it. Of all my Beefheart albums, it's probably the one that gets the fewest spins (I never bothered with BJ&MB or Unconditionally Guaranteed).


It's been a while since I've "spun" it but UG gets relatively high marks from me. Particularly the first half (along with "This is the Day" and "Peaches")
Hey, I dig "Would You Like A Snack" and "Building a Girl", doesn't mean I can think "Dinah Moe" isn't a fantastic ditty, does it? :mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 3:46 pm 
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The package, the graphics, the notes and the music - best release of 2012 to date!

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2012 4:51 am 
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Info at discogs:

http://www.discogs.com/release/3431255

It seems Captain Beefheart produced the album, and noone produced the CD.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2012 6:58 am 
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Dark Clothes wrote:
Info at discogs:

http://www.discogs.com/release/3431255

It seems Captain Beefheart produced the album, and noone produced the CD.


WOT!? I thought it was produced by Frank Zappa?


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 1:24 pm 
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Bat Chain Puller has arrived in Norway! And a beauty it is...

First impressions:

The album is tougher, more angular than Shiny Beast, but mellower than Doc At The Radar Station. It's intimate and demanding. Great stuff!

Bat Chain Puller - a fabulous tune to start the album. This version is sort of leaner than the one we know and love from Shiny Beast. Different. More rootsy. I would say that the SB version is even more amazing, but this is also fine.

Seam Crooked Sam - A small, keyboard led ensemble accompanies Don's poetry recital with some extremely intricate music. Laidback and intense at the same time. A different flavour of beef, and unmissable.

Harry Irene - if you like it on Shiny Beast, you'll like it even more here.

81 Poop Hatch - same recording as on Ice Cream for Crow. I've always felt that it's slightly out of place on that album, but it fits in well here - following the recitation of Seam Crooked Sam. This is a strong, cohesive album!

Flavor Bud Living - John French's religious take. Slower than the Doc version. Sounds fuller. Beautiful!

Brick Bats - a fabulous version of a great song. Extended instrumental section. Best version of that tune, I'm sure.

Floppy Boot Stomp - a decent version, but the one on Shiny Beast is possibly even better.

Carrot - again a slower and fuller sounding version than on Doc At The Radar Station - and absolutely gorgeous.

Owed T'Alex - fabulous tune, fabulous version. Denny Walley's guitar part is the original and best, although I'll always love the Shiny Beast take as well.

Odd Jobs - this is one of the true revelations of Bat Chain Puller - what poetry, what music! It does sound very similar to the take on Grow Fins, but much cleaner and punchier soundwise. A must for any Beefheart fan, for sure.

Human Totem Pole - another incredible song, and this original version is way stronger than the one on Ice Cream for Crow. What a collection of tunes Beefheart had for BCP! A handful of his best ever songs, like Clear Spot with three or four Big Eyed Beans From Venus, and totally cohesive, strong material on top of that. Tis a pity people didn't get to hear this in 1976. Minds would have been blown...

Apes-Ma - at long last where she belongs - at the tail end of Bat Chain Puller. Apes-Ma's always been a fine conclusion to Shiny Beast, but the track works even better here, concluding the strain of poetry recitals in the fabric of the album.

Bonus Tracks:

Bat Chain Puller - remix by Kerry McNabb. I like this a lot - it sounds clearer than the mix that opens the album. Again a different version of a fabulous tune, and another great moment of the CD.

Candle Mambo - the tune John French said that Frank Zappa nixed, when he still maintained that FZ produced the album. A worthy inclusion, although the song is realized more fully on Shiny Beast, and fits better with that fine album's particular flavour.

Hoboism - Denny Walley strums the guitar and Don improvises poetry. I haven't digested the lyrics, but it's undoubtedly an exciting contribution to the CD. This would have fit in on Grow Fins, and the sound quality is better than many tracks there. Needs more dwelling on - which is a good thing!

All in all a wonderful release!

8)

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 2:36 pm 
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Dark Clothes wrote:
Bat Chain Puller has arrived in Norway! And a beauty it is...

First impressions:

The album is tougher, more angular than Shiny Beast, but mellower than Doc At The Radar Station. It's intimate and demanding. Great stuff!

Bat Chain Puller - a fabulous tune to start the album. This version is sort of leaner than the one we know and love from Shiny Beast. Different. More rootsy. I would say that the SB version is even more amazing, although this one is also great.

Seam Crooked Sam - A small, keyboard led ensemble accompanies Don's poetry recital with some extremely intricate music. Laidback and intense at the same time. A different flavour of beef, and unmissable.

Harry Irene - if you like it on Shiny Beast, you'll like it even more here.

81 Poop Hatch - same recording as on Ice Cream for Crow. I've always felt that it's slightly out of place on that album, but it fits in well here - following the recitation of Seam Crooked Sam. This is a strong, cohesive album!

Flavor Bud Living - John French's religious take. Slower than the Doc version. Sounds fuller. Beautiful!

Brick Bats - a fabulous version of a great track. Extended instrumental section. Best version of that track, I'm sure.

Floppy Boot Stomp - a decent version, but the one on Shiny Beast is possibly even better.

Carrot - again a slower and fuller sounding version than on Doc At The Radar Station - and absolutely gorgeous.

Owed T'Alex - fabulous tune, fabulous version. Denny Walley's guitar part is the original and best, although I'll always love the Shiny Beast take as well.

Odd Jobs - this is one of the true revelations of Bat Chain Puller - what poetry, what music! It does sound very similar to the take on Grow Fins, but much cleaner and punchier soundwise. A must for any Beefheart fan, for sure.

Human Totem Pole - another incredibly great song, and this original version is way stronger than the one on Ice Cream for Crow. What a collection of great tunes Beefheart had for BCP! A handful of his best ever songs, like Clear Spot with three or four Big Eyed Beans From Venus, and totally cohesive, strong material on top of that. Tis a pity people didn't get to hear this in 1976. Minds would have been blown...

Apes-Ma - at long last where she belongs - at the tail end of Bat Chain Puller. Apes-Ma's always been a fine conclusion to Shiny Beast, but the track works even better here, concluding the strain of poetry recitals in the fabric of the album.

Bonus Tracks:

Bat Chain Puller - remix by Kerry McNabb. A like this a lot - it sounds clearer than the mix that opens the album. Again a different version of a fabulous tune, and another great moment of the CD.

Candle Mambo - the tune John French said that Frank Zappa nixed, when he still maintained that FZ produced the album. A worthy inclusion, although the song is realized more fully on Shiny Beast, and fits better with that fine album's particular flavour.

Hoboism - Denny Walley strums the guitar and Don improvises poetry. I haven't digested the lyrics, but it's undoubtedly an exciting contribution to the CD. This would have fit in on Grow Fins, and the sound quality is better than many tracks there. Needs more dwelling on - which is a good thing!

All in all a wonderful release!

8)


Great review thanks.
Also love your Stalker avatar.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 4:47 am 
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I haven't changed my mind much after the first impressions, although I'm warming up to the three tracks where I had some reservations when comparing to Shiny Beast - BCP itself, Floppy Boot Stomp and Candle Mambo. These versions are different - not necessarily less accomplished than on SB. Same thing with Owed T'Alex, although the Shiny Beast take has a precision and sheer visceral power that isn't quite there in this more intimate setting. But who could fault Denny Walley's playing? Not me!

Like other reporters around the net, I had some difficulties removing the disc the first time. It's easy now, since I worked a little on the nob with a worthless CD (I think it was disc 2 of my four year old son's Dolly Parton Collection)...

It's well nigh impossible to put the booklet back in without some aid - The Ultimate Dolly Parton works well for this also. Just put the little Dolly thing inside the cover flap and slide the booklet in behind, in a totally wholesome, unsensual way!

Anyway - a wonderful album it is - a rare beauty of music and words - an art work. It's hard to measure the quality of art, so I won't compare it to other albums in that sense. But it's surely up there among the best of Beefheart. I will listen to it more often than Trout Mask Replica, and with more unadulterated pleasure.

Oh, and again - this is an intimate album - a small band, and Don's voice close up. It runs the gamut of his talents, without losing focus. I find it very personal and directly appealing. An unmissable contribution to Beefheart's work.

PS. Buffalo Voice - with your love for vintage synth sounds, you shouldn't hesitate anymore - get it!

John Thomas: Piano [Acoustic], Piano [Rhodes], Synthesizer [Mini Moog (bass And Effects)]

8)

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 12:26 am 
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It's arrived 8)
I'm gonna be listening to it on the way home from work tonight in my car (great Bose system), full fucking blast.
How the frigging hell will that sound to passers by!?! :mrgreen:

Thanks to Gail and everybody involved

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 3:43 am 
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Dark Clothes wrote:
PS. Buffalo Voice - [...] John Thomas: Synthesizer [Mini Moog (bass And Effects)

------------------------------_/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l/l____Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_Гl_------------------------------
On Moog en vogue, hehe! :)
I'm acquiescently saving up for my next BS/CB/FZ order, thats right. It won't happen before August, I'm afraid.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 11:59 pm 
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Have you heard the latest? Denny Walley says he didn't play on the take of Hoboism that is released on the Vaulternative BCP! So who did? - Check out the Captain Beefheart Radar Station for details.

Edit: http://www.beefheart.com/datharp/albums/official/batchainpuller.htm

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Last edited by Dark Clothes on Sun Mar 18, 2012 2:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 2:11 pm 
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Dark Clothes wrote:
Have you heard the latest? Denny Walley says he didn't play on the take of Hoboism that is released on the Vaulternative BCP! So who did? - Check out the Captain Beefheart Radar Station for details.

Very interesting. So where did this track come from and who plays on it? It has to be Tepper or Redus, my guess. Still haven't ordered it. Waiting it out, hoping it shows up in other stores.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 9:36 pm 
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Location: Pouting for you? Punky Meadows, pouting for you?!!
Got mine at last. Yawn. I'm not an FZ fanatic - the guy was just a human being - but I am a full on FZ music admirer and have a great deal of respect for his composition prowess. I'm not just a fan of Overnite, Apostrophe and One Size - I love Favorites, Boulez/Stranger, LSO and Yellow Shark equally. That's why I come to this forum. I'm getting a bit tired of the pompous asses who come here to tell people how to listen to Beefheart and where they're getting it wrong and basically questioning anyone's right to have an opinion and god forbid dare to speak of it out loud.

Frank Zappa is quite underrated. He was one of the most talented composers of the 20th century. Beefheart is way overrated and marginally talented at best, and anyone who thinks they can reeducate me can just keep on spinning on the cosmic utensil.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 12:38 am 
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Didn't you say much the same about Velvet Underground and Lou Reed, poly? It seems a certain wild strain of rock 'n' roll rubs you the wrong way... Of course Van Vliet couldn't have written something like Bob in Dacron, but then again - would he have wanted to? The prodigious composer himself said: "Pay attention to this man's music, because if you don't you might miss something important. And we wouldn't want that to happen to you. Because you need all the friends you can get." (FZ, MC for CB at Amougies, 1969)

Your post raises an interesting question about 'pompous asses'. Do you want to be lectured by someone who likes the stuff, or someone who doesn't care for it?

I respect your view, just as I can understand that someone doesn't care for Zappa's guitar solos. But it doesn't affect my appreciation and enjoyment of the stuff. Ok, Zappa had an edge on Don as a composer, but Van Vliet was a greater intuitive poet, if you ask me.

You were afraid you'd be the devil's red wife
But it's alright, God dug yer dance
'n would have you young 'n in his harem
Dress you the way he wants, cause he never had uh doll
Cause everybody made him uh boy
'n God didn't think t' ask his preference
You can bring yer dress 'n yer favorite dog
'n yer husband's cane
'n yer old spotted hog
Cause in this lifetime
You've got m'human gets me blues

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