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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 6:46 am 
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Seems like a nice new topic for rantings...

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 7:39 am 
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Exactly. Bail ou the rich, and you pay the bill...

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 9:03 am 
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We can thank Woodrow Wilson and the Congress in 1913 for most of our banking woes. At one point in history our money had some REAL value.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 9:15 am 
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I liked the one where John McCain was at a campaign rally and said "The fundamentals of our economy are strong." Three hours later, as the stock markets were melting down, he was at another rally and said "The fundamentals of our economy are at risk."

You don't have to be Chairman of The Fed to figure out that when people can't pay their m0rtgages, the next ones in line for an ass kicking are the investment bankers who hold the m0rtgages. After that, it's the markets those investors play in, then the people who have their retirement funds in those markets.

There are really only two good investments left: a nice mattress to hide your cash under, and a gun...

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 10:09 am 
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MentalTossFlycoon wrote:
There are really only two good investments left: a nice mattress to hide your cash under, and a gun...


Nice! And it just so happens I'm comparison shopping for both.Image

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 4:46 pm 
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Yea it's time to buy a gun and head for the hills!

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 4:57 pm 
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AbamiEdo wrote:
We can thank Woodrow Wilson and the Congress in 1913 for most of our banking woes. At one point in history our money had some REAL value.


Ding-ding-ding, nail on the head :)

Our Fed creates money as the principle of new loans (our money is backed by nothing but the promise to repay), but make us pay back principle plus interest so the only way we can get money for the interest is through new loans, until we're so in debt we can't borrow anymore.

(And the more they "bail us out" the more as surfs we become).

F = P/P+I

Where F equals foreclosures, P equals principle, and I equals interest.

The only limit on how much money can be printed is how far in debt people are willing to go, (or their leaders are willing to send them). When the limit is reached, the music stops.

No way out...

...unless Congress starts printing our own money again (as Lincoln and Jackson did), but then again, McCain and Obama aren't going there, that would cut out they're sponsors, and we can't have them losing..

Woodrow Wilson said before his death in 1924 on being conned into chartering The Federal Reserve, "I have unwittingly ruined my country."

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 3:31 am 
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Great title for this thread. That's exactly what we were saying yesterday while watching the hearing on a Wall St bailout. I found it amusing that Paulson & Benerke couldn't admit we were already in a recession. ,That financial institutions needed the $700 Billion so Americans could start borrowing again. Isn't that how we got here to begin with? Bogus loans with worthless paper being sold in blocks that traveled around the world before the foreclosures hit like a ton of bricks. It's a band-aid that could very well put this country in to another depression. To bail-out those who out of greed caused the problem is putting the fox in charge of the hen house. 8)

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 5:39 am 
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My previous rant here has been suspended to bring you the following post below :wink: --

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Last edited by swiftkicknow on Wed Sep 24, 2008 9:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 9:35 am 
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I just got this in an email. Here it is unedited:

Wednesday, September 24, 2008

Dear Friends,

Whenever a Great Bipartisan Consensus is announced, and a compliant media assures everyone that the wondrous actions of our wise leaders are being taken for our own good, you can know with absolute certainty that disaster is about to strike.

The events of the past week are no exception.

The bailout package that is about to be rammed down Congress' throat is not just economically foolish. It is downright sinister. It makes a mockery of our Constitution, which our leaders should never again bother pretending is still in effect. It promises the American people a never-ending nightmare of ever-greater debt liabilities they will have to shoulder. Two weeks ago, financial analyst Jim Rogers said the bailout of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac made America more communist than China! "This is welfare for the rich," he said. "This is socialism for the rich. It's bailing out the financiers, the banks, the Wall Streeters."

That describes the current bailout package to a T. And we're being told it's unavoidable.

The claim that the market caused all this is so staggeringly foolish that only politicians and the media could pretend to believe it. But that has become the conventional wisdom, with the desired result that those responsible for the credit bubble and its predictable consequences - predictable, that is, to those who understand sound, Austrian economics - are being let off the hook. The Federal Reserve System is actually positioning itself as the savior, rather than the culprit, in this mess!

• The Treasury Secretary is authorized to purchase up to $700 billion in m0rtgage-related assets at any one time. That means $700 billion is only the very beginning of what will hit us.

• Financial institutions are "designated as financial agents of the Government." This is the New Deal to end all New Deals.

• Then there's this: "Decisions by the Secretary pursuant to the authority of this Act are non-reviewable and committed to agency discretion, and may not be reviewed by any court of law or any administrative agency." Translation: the Secretary can buy up whatever junk debt he wants to, burden the American people with it, and be subject to no one in the process.

There goes your country.

Even some so-called free-market economists are calling all this "sadly necessary." Sad, yes. Necessary? Don't make me laugh.

Our one-party system is complicit in yet another crime against the American people. The two major party candidates for president themselves initially indicated their strong support for bailouts of this kind - another example of the big choice we're supposedly presented with this November: yes or yes. Now, with a backlash brewing, they're not quite sure what their views are. A sad display, really.

Although the present bailout package is almost certainly not the end of the political atrocities we'll witness in connection with the crisis, time is short. Congress may vote as soon as tomorrow. With a Rasmussen poll finding support for the bailout at an anemic seven percent, some members of Congress are afraid to vote for it. Call them! Let them hear from you! Tell them you will never vote for anyone who supports this atrocity.

The issue boils down to this: do we care about freedom? Do we care about responsibility and accountability? Do we care that our government and media have been bought and paid for? Do we care that average Americans are about to be looted in order to subsidize the fattest of cats on Wall Street and in government? Do we care?

When the chips are down, will we stand up and fight, even if it means standing up against every stripe of fashionable opinion in politics and the media?

Times like these have a way of telling us what kind of a people we are, and what kind of country we shall be.

In liberty,

Ron Paul

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 9:39 am 
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Apparently Warren Buffet is going to fork out 5 BILLION dollars to help, how about all those people who raped the stock market fork out some cash too? In return they get less jail time. We'll see how much they come up with and THEN and only then, talk about help from the federal reserve.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 9:52 am 
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adamsoon wrote:
Apparently Warren Buffet is going to fork out 5 BILLION dollars to help..


Ken Killian, a finance professional in Dallas, Texas, writes:

Buffett is an opportunist. Goldman is now a commercial bank and a cheap one at that. The vulture simply swooped in. Let's recognize it for what it is. He's no savior.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 10:50 am 
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Paul Krugman in NYT:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/22/opinion/22krugman.html

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:56 pm 
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Amazing.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 5:46 pm 
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Well, I wish I had more time to post, but someone turned the blender on MED-HIGH...but my basic quick comment:

We are getting a rare view of collusion, from the cesspool to the top. Bernanke, liason Administration to the Fed familys, (Rothschilds, Warburgs, Morgans, etc), Paulson from Bush and the treasury and exCEO of the big assed bank that coincidentially is managing most of the deal), colluding with the Senate Banking Comittee, the top dog responsible policemen charged with looking the other way for the last two years (there was another comittee that looked the other way before them), while the "hitherto unseen" bubble reached fruition.

And they're telling us to hurry up and get Congress to pass the deal on up to Bush who'll sign it...then we'll see if Japan and China will float the deal, (how much will the dollar drop) :cry: The taxpayers'll will pay Japan and China back for this later, when they pay 'em back for the wars...

Now how do we pass this off to the surfs and get them to vote for us for doing it?

Is this any way to run a superpower?

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 6:44 pm 
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I'm just wondering why this big mess is unfolding now, less than two months before the election.

I have a feeling that the republican party and their friends in corporate america have decided that they are going to lose, and they're taking the opportunity to run off with as much money as they can, and leave the biggest mess they possibly can, behind them, for others to clean up...

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:53 pm 
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....as they always do.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 10:05 pm 
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as the budget deficit grows

it slowly becomes a worldwide suckout ..

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 2:45 am 
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BTW SPACEBROTHER and Lumpy, the Republicans in Congress are fighting against the bailout a lot harder than the Dems at the moment.

Just to keep the record straight, and if passed, it will be the Dems in charge of passing it, not only in control of the Congress, but in control of the Senate Banking Comittee, (the agency that's been in charge of oversight during the last two years of this bubble's growth...hmmm, I wonder how they missed it, I was posting about it two years ago)>

Banking typically gives more to the Dems than the R's...

Seven of Obama's top 14 doners, (in order of money given, look who's number one):
Goldman Sachs, UBS AG, Lehman Brothers, JP Morgan Chase, Citigroup, Morgan Stanley and Credit Suisse.
They all gave to McCain too, but only about 2/3rds as much.

I'm no fan of the corrupt in either party but this "free pass for the complicit dems" is dangerous bullshit...and as I said, number's wise, the R's are fighting against the bailout harder than the Dems.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:11 am 
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Sounds to me like the Obamites/Republicrats are allready making excuses for their boy Barry sorry couldn't resist. Isn't there something called the Committee on Oversight and Government Reform, and isn't Henry A. Waxman the Chairman? Why does Bush get all the blame from alot of people on this messageboard, when most all of the Republicrats are to blame. Some of u can only spit out the talking points and it is starting to make me sick. Your so called Democrats have betrayed you, and will continue. THEY ARE NO BETTER THAN THE REPUBLICANS!

Committee Jurisdiction
Legislative Responsibilities
The legislative jurisdiction of the Committee on Oversight and Government Reform includes the following areas, as set forth in House Rule X, clause 1:

• Federal civil service, including intergovernmental personnel; and the status of officers and employees of the United States, including their compensation, classification, and retirement;
• Municipal affairs of the District of Columbia in general (other than appropriations);
• Federal paperwork reduction;
Government management and accounting measures generally;• Holidays and celebrations;
• Overall economy, efficiency, and management of government operations and activities, including federal procurement;
• National archives;
• Population and demography generally, including the Census;
• Postal service generally, including transportation of the mails;
• Public information and records;
Relationship of the federal government to the states and municipalities generally; andReorganizations in the executive branch of the government.


This is a list of all members of this committee.
Chairman Henry A. Waxman, California
Rep. Edolphus Towns, New York
Rep. Paul E. Kanjorski, Pennsylvania
Rep. Carolyn B. Maloney, New York
Rep. Elijah E. Cummings, Maryland
Rep. Dennis J. Kucinich, Ohio
Rep. Danny K. Davis, Illinois
Rep. John F. Tierney, Massachusetts
Rep. Wm. Lacy Clay, Missouri
Rep. Diane E. Watson, California
Rep. Stephen F. Lynch, Massachusetts
Rep. Brian Higgins, New York
Rep. John A. Yarmuth, Kentucky
Rep. Bruce L. Braley, Iowa
Rep. Eleanor Holmes Norton, District of Columbia
Rep. Betty McCollum, Minnesota
Rep. Jim Cooper, Tennessee
Rep. Chris Van Hollen, Maryland
Rep. Paul W. Hodes, New Hampshire
Rep. Christopher S. Murphy, Connecticut
Rep. John P. Sarbanes, Maryland
Rep. Peter Welch, Vermont
Rep. Jackie Speier, California
Republicans
Rep. Tom Davis, Virginia, Ranking Minority Member
Rep. Dan Burton, Indiana
Rep. Christopher Shays, Connecticut
Rep. John M. McHugh, New York
Rep. John L. Mica, Florida
Rep. Mark E. Souder, Indiana
Rep. Todd Russell Platts, Pennsylvania
Rep. Chris Cannon, Utah
Rep. John J. Duncan, Jr., Tennessee
Rep. Michael Turner, Ohio
Rep. Darrell E. Issa, California
Rep. Kenny Marchant, Texas
Rep. Lynn A. Westmoreland, Georgia
Rep. Patrick T. McHenry, North Carolina
Rep. Virginia Foxx, North Carolina
Rep. Brian Bilbray, California
Rep. Bill Sali, Idaho
Rep. Jim Jordan, Ohio

Sorry such a long post but I think people should start to do some research, I can guarantee that you will be enlightened. I don't want to seem one sided so, MOST ALL REPUBLICANS ARE PIECES OF SHIT!!

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 7:42 am 
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AbamiEdo wrote:
Why does Bush get all the blame from alot of people on this messageboard, when most all of the Republicrats are to blame.

On my part, it's because I couldn't squeeze "The current Bush administration" into the thread title so I had to shorten it to just naming their figurehead :wink:

Quote:
Your so called Democrats have betrayed you, and will continue. THEY ARE NO BETTER THAN THE REPUBLICANS!

I completely agree

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 11:55 am 
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AbamiEdo wrote:
Your so called Democrats have betrayed you, and will continue. THEY ARE NO BETTER THAN THE REPUBLICANS!


The democrats havent' betrayed me because I've always thought both parties suck. It's just that the dems suck a bit less..... I will give props to the republicans for having nerve. At least they are right out there with their shit. The dems, bless their pointed little heads, have no discernable backbone, and they run scared whenever things get rough (see their positions on Israel, Iraq, and the money crisis for starters). I'm a lefty, so I usually vote democratic, but if I saw a better alternative who could win I'd go for it. I don't now.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 1:16 pm 
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Ronny's Noomies wrote:
The democrats havent' betrayed me because I've always thought both parties suck. It's just that the dems suck a bit less..... I will give props to the republicans for having nerve. At least they are right out there with their shit. The dems, bless their pointed little heads, have no discernable backbone, and they run scared whenever things get rough (see their positions on Israel, Iraq, and the money crisis for starters). I'm a lefty, so I usually vote democratic, but if I saw a better alternative who could win I'd go for it. I don't now.


You have strongly been campaigning for Obama for quite a while on here. So, based on what you just wrote above, you are saying that you believe that Obama has a pointy little head, no discernable backbone, and will run scared whenever things get rough. And we should listen to you on how we should vote and choose Obama because voting for him means we wouldn't be stupidly throwing our vote away. :roll:

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 4:15 pm 
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We also have to thank Richard "Tricky Dick" Nixon for getting off the Gold Standard back in the '70s.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 3:57 am 
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Galoot Co-Log-Nuh wrote:
We also have to thank Richard "Tricky Dick" Nixon for getting off the Gold Standard back in the '70s.


Definatetly, was that in 71.

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