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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 8:53 pm 
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Hi.

Welcome to page 82 of the Ron Paul is a closet Nazi thread. Here is where the previous page left off...





Denial Boy wrote:
SPACEBROTHER wrote:
Meanwhile, Denial Boy is still dodging the question...


POT. KETTLE. BLACK.

"POT. KETTLE. BLACK." is your best answer as to what attracts white supremacists, terrorist militias and conspiracy kooks to the votes, social policies and platform of Ron Paul, Rand Paul and the Libertarian party? :roll:


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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2014 11:50 am 
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The "Alternative For Germany" Party (AfD) has apparently bought advertising space on the "Daily Paul" website. Their slogan: "Courage for Germany". They aren't neo-Nazis, they're just sort of half Nazis. Another popular character on Ron Paul sites is Nigel Farage of UKiP. Farage isn't a Nazi - he's just an idiot. Wonder at him explaining how, although he has bilingual kids and a German wife, he doesn't like to hear people speaking foreign languages on trains.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niWSEn5NNAE.
It gets particularly amusing at 11:25.

I make no deductions about Ron Paul or his supporters by posting this, but quite a lot about Nigel Farage and the AfD.

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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2014 2:21 pm 
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tweedle-dumb wrote:
"POT. KETTLE. BLACK." is your best answer as to what attracts white supremacists, terrorist militias and conspiracy kooks to the votes, social policies and platform of Ron Paul, Rand Paul and the Libertarian party? :roll:


My POT. KETTLE. BLACK. response wasn't an answer to that. It was a statement based on your previous statement, which was this:

tweedle-dumb wrote:
Meanwhile, Denial Boy is still dodging the question...




You are fucked in the head. I mean, REALLY fucked in the head...

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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2014 5:09 pm 
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Caputh wrote:
The "Alternative For Germany" Party (AfD) has apparently bought advertising space on the "Daily Paul" website. Their slogan: "Courage for Germany". They aren't neo-Nazis, they're just sort of half Nazis. Another popular character on Ron Paul sites is Nigel Farage of UKiP. Farage isn't a Nazi - he's just an idiot. Wonder at him explaining how, although he has bilingual kids and a German wife, he doesn't like to hear people speaking foreign languages on trains.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niWSEn5NNAE.
It gets particularly amusing at 11:25.

I make no deductions about Ron Paul or his supporters by posting this, but quite a lot about Nigel Farage and the AfD.



Not surprisingly, you misinterpreted Nigel's statements and didn't provide the correct context for his comments relating to the issues of immigration.


Meanwhile, the Best of Nigel Farage...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfjtneGa70g

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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2014 10:33 pm 
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SPACEBROTHER wrote:
Caputh wrote:
SPACEBROTHER wrote:
What specific social policies, votes and platforms of Ron Paul, Rand Paul and the Libertarian party attracts white supremacist groups, terrorist militia groups and kooky conspiracy theorists?


How 'bout you rephrase the question - then he might answer it.

I'll give it a go...

"What specific social policies, votes and platforms of Ron Paul, Rand Paul and the Libertarian party attracts people of segregationist, non-conformist, anti-establishment and possibly subversive viewpoints?"


Meanwhile, Denial Boy is still dodging the question...



Return of the son of...meanwhile, Denial Boy is still dodging a straight forward question. :roll:


Last edited by SPACEBROTHER on Sun May 18, 2014 4:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun May 18, 2014 12:33 am 
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Disco Boy wrote:
Caputh wrote:
The "Alternative For Germany" Party (AfD) has apparently bought advertising space on the "Daily Paul" website. Their slogan: "Courage for Germany". They aren't neo-Nazis, they're just sort of half Nazis. Another popular character on Ron Paul sites is Nigel Farage of UKiP. Farage isn't a Nazi - he's just an idiot. Wonder at him explaining how, although he has bilingual kids and a German wife, he doesn't like to hear people speaking foreign languages on trains.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niWSEn5NNAE.
It gets particularly amusing at 11:25.

I make no deductions about Ron Paul or his supporters by posting this, but quite a lot about Nigel Farage and the AfD.



Not surprisingly, you misinterpreted Nigel's statements and didn't provide the correct context for his comments relating to the issues of immigration.


Meanwhile, the Best of Nigel Farage...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfjtneGa70g


Feel free to offer an alternate interpretation for the following transcript from the interview I posted above:

O'Brien: "...Let me just move on, then to that invitation to go overseas and listen to conversations in other countries where perhaps far-right politics are not viewed as askance as in this country. You've mentioned your discomfort at listening to foreign languages on a train recently."

Farage: "I made the point that I got on a train and went for several stops and there were lot of people around me and no one spoke English and I didn't object to it, I felt slightly uncomfortable. I think, actually, isn't that the problem? Isn't this of all the all countries in Europe the most accepting the most tolerant..."

O'Brien: "You said I don't feel very comfortable in that situation. You did say you had a problem."

Farage: "I didn't feel comfortable, no."

O'Brien:"Your wife is a German speaker."

Farage: "Well, my children are, too."

O'Brien: "Does that make you feel uncomfortable?"

Farage: "No, no, because they can speak English and the whole point about that..."

O'Brien: "Well, how do you know those people couldn't?"

Farage: "Well, maybe they could, but I got the distinct feeling that it certainly wasn't their language of choice and if you look at the primary school situation in the East End of London, where you've now got schools where a majority don't speak English, doesn't that say to us that we want a sensible, balanced immigration policy, where we want people with skills to come into Britain, but we also want integration into society?"

O'Brien: "Of course we do, and the schools you refer to, the pupils you refer to are registered and recorded as having English as a second language, they're not registered and recorded as not being able to speak English, that's precisely that sort of..."

Farage: "And some of both.."

O'Brien: "Yes, but no one has counted them, so your own children would fit into that category."

Farage: "Well, hopefully lots of people can speak different languages, but the point I'm making is, do we want to live in an integrated society?"

O'Brien: "No, no, forgive me, the point you're making is schools in the East End are full of children who can't speak English. I just want you to recognize that that is not true, what you just said. The children who are typified as speaking English as a second language would include your own daughters - their mother tongue being German."

Farage: "They come from homes where English is most definitely not the first language and in many cases is not the language at all. Now, look..."

O'Brien: "But no one's counted the second case...

Farage: "No, no they haven't and it would be very helpful and useful if they did and perhaps we'd be even more surprised and shocked, but the argument..."

O'Brien:"Or perhaps we'd realize that most bilingual children in this country are children like yours."

Farage: "Let's turn it 'round the other way, shall we?"

O'Brien: "Yes, let's."

Farage: "Let's talk about immigration, let's talk about Europe, let's talk about the European elections. I am making one very simple point. We cannot have any form of managed migration into Britain and remain a member of the European Union because we have an open door to nearly half a billion people. And the argument, James, I'm putting is this: we'd be far better to have an immigration policy that didn't, as it currently does, discriminate against engineers from India or doctors from New Zealand, in favour of anybody, regardless of skill levels or backgrounds, coming from southern and eastern Europe. And that is the great debate. And when Nick Clegg took me on and I tried to have that debate with him and he was very reluctant on that particular point to engage. Cameron and Miliband run a country mile away from that debate and that I think is that the heart of our relationship with Europe."

O'Brien. "Indeed, and if that was the debate you'd offered to have on this programme, we'd have it now, but what the caller asked you was why so many people think you're racist?"

Farage: "Well, I think yes, we've had our idiots..."

O'Brien. "And part of the answer would be you talk about children who can't speak English as a first language without mentioning that it includes your own children."

Farage: "What is racism? Is racism between races?"

O'Brien: "Don't you know? How can you say you're not something if you don't know what it is?"

Farage: "Is race about colour? Is race about race? Is it about nationality? I made a comment there, that wasn't meant to say anything more than I felt uncomfortable about the rate and pace of change..."

O'Brien: "No, you made a comment that you felt uncomfortable about people speaking foreign languages, despite the fact that presumably your own wife does when she phones home to Germany."

Farage: "I don't suppose she speaks it on the train, that's the point I'm making."

O'Brien: "Why not? Isn't she allowed to? Can't she speak German wherever she wants?"

Farage: "Of course people are allowed to..."

O'Brien: "And what about the line about not wanting to live next door to Romanians? It's perfectly acceptable..."

Farage: "I was asked if a group of Romanian men moved in next door to me: "Would you be concerned?""

O'Brien: "What about if a group of German children did? What's the difference?"

Farage. "There is a difference and you know there is."




BTW. I don't agree that there is a "Best of Farage" possible - he's completely abysmal.

I also find it rather interesting that the youtube clip you posted is heavily cut and consists of soundbites from various statements of his to remove any possible context, whereas I posted a link to an entire, uncut interview with the moron.

Still, nice to know you're on first name terms...

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PostPosted: Sun May 18, 2014 6:51 pm 
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tweedle-dumb wrote:
Return of the son of...meanwhile, Denial Boy is still dodging a straight forward question. :roll:


Meanwhile, tweedle-dumb is still not acknowledging my point...

Caputh wrote:
Disco Boy wrote:
Caputh wrote:
The "Alternative For Germany" Party (AfD) has apparently bought advertising space on the "Daily Paul" website. Their slogan: "Courage for Germany". They aren't neo-Nazis, they're just sort of half Nazis. Another popular character on Ron Paul sites is Nigel Farage of UKiP. Farage isn't a Nazi - he's just an idiot. Wonder at him explaining how, although he has bilingual kids and a German wife, he doesn't like to hear people speaking foreign languages on trains.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niWSEn5NNAE.
It gets particularly amusing at 11:25.

I make no deductions about Ron Paul or his supporters by posting this, but quite a lot about Nigel Farage and the AfD.



Not surprisingly, you misinterpreted Nigel's statements and didn't provide the correct context for his comments relating to the issues of immigration.


Meanwhile, the Best of Nigel Farage...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfjtneGa70g


Feel free to offer an alternate interpretation for the following transcript from the interview I posted above:

O'Brien: "...Let me just move on, then to that invitation to go overseas and listen to conversations in other countries where perhaps far-right politics are not viewed as askance as in this country. You've mentioned your discomfort at listening to foreign languages on a train recently."

Farage: "I made the point that I got on a train and went for several stops and there were lot of people around me and no one spoke English and I didn't object to it, I felt slightly uncomfortable. I think, actually, isn't that the problem? Isn't this of all the all countries in Europe the most accepting the most tolerant..."

O'Brien: "You said I don't feel very comfortable in that situation. You did say you had a problem."

Farage: "I didn't feel comfortable, no."

O'Brien:"Your wife is a German speaker."

Farage: "Well, my children are, too."

O'Brien: "Does that make you feel uncomfortable?"

Farage: "No, no, because they can speak English and the whole point about that..."

O'Brien: "Well, how do you know those people couldn't?"

Farage: "Well, maybe they could, but I got the distinct feeling that it certainly wasn't their language of choice and if you look at the primary school situation in the East End of London, where you've now got schools where a majority don't speak English, doesn't that say to us that we want a sensible, balanced immigration policy, where we want people with skills to come into Britain, but we also want integration into society?"

O'Brien: "Of course we do, and the schools you refer to, the pupils you refer to are registered and recorded as having English as a second language, they're not registered and recorded as not being able to speak English, that's precisely that sort of..."

Farage: "And some of both.."

O'Brien: "Yes, but no one has counted them, so your own children would fit into that category."

Farage: "Well, hopefully lots of people can speak different languages, but the point I'm making is, do we want to live in an integrated society?"

O'Brien: "No, no, forgive me, the point you're making is schools in the East End are full of children who can't speak English. I just want you to recognize that that is not true, what you just said. The children who are typified as speaking English as a second language would include your own daughters - their mother tongue being German."

Farage: "They come from homes where English is most definitely not the first language and in many cases is not the language at all. Now, look..."

O'Brien: "But no one's counted the second case...

Farage: "No, no they haven't and it would be very helpful and useful if they did and perhaps we'd be even more surprised and shocked, but the argument..."

O'Brien:"Or perhaps we'd realize that most bilingual children in this country are children like yours."

Farage: "Let's turn it 'round the other way, shall we?"

O'Brien: "Yes, let's."

Farage: "Let's talk about immigration, let's talk about Europe, let's talk about the European elections. I am making one very simple point. We cannot have any form of managed migration into Britain and remain a member of the European Union because we have an open door to nearly half a billion people. And the argument, James, I'm putting is this: we'd be far better to have an immigration policy that didn't, as it currently does, discriminate against engineers from India or doctors from New Zealand, in favour of anybody, regardless of skill levels or backgrounds, coming from southern and eastern Europe. And that is the great debate. And when Nick Clegg took me on and I tried to have that debate with him and he was very reluctant on that particular point to engage. Cameron and Miliband run a country mile away from that debate and that I think is that the heart of our relationship with Europe."

O'Brien. "Indeed, and if that was the debate you'd offered to have on this programme, we'd have it now, but what the caller asked you was why so many people think you're racist?"

Farage: "Well, I think yes, we've had our idiots..."

O'Brien. "And part of the answer would be you talk about children who can't speak English as a first language without mentioning that it includes your own children."

Farage: "What is racism? Is racism between races?"

O'Brien: "Don't you know? How can you say you're not something if you don't know what it is?"

Farage: "Is race about colour? Is race about race? Is it about nationality? I made a comment there, that wasn't meant to say anything more than I felt uncomfortable about the rate and pace of change..."

O'Brien: "No, you made a comment that you felt uncomfortable about people speaking foreign languages, despite the fact that presumably your own wife does when she phones home to Germany."

Farage: "I don't suppose she speaks it on the train, that's the point I'm making."

O'Brien: "Why not? Isn't she allowed to? Can't she speak German wherever she wants?"

Farage: "Of course people are allowed to..."

O'Brien: "And what about the line about not wanting to live next door to Romanians? It's perfectly acceptable..."

Farage: "I was asked if a group of Romanian men moved in next door to me: "Would you be concerned?""

O'Brien: "What about if a group of German children did? What's the difference?"

Farage. "There is a difference and you know there is."


That's NOT the complete transcript.

Btw, I see nothing wrong with Nigel's comments.


Caputh wrote:
I also find it rather interesting that the youtube clip you posted is heavily cut and consists of soundbites from various statements of his to remove any possible context, whereas I posted a link to an entire, uncut interview with the moron.

Still, nice to know you're on first name terms...


You do know what "best of" means, right?

But then again, I don't think you're very bright. So I'm not surprised why you'd think there was something wrong with his comments or the "best of" clip I posted.

Typical socialists - always upset at things they don't even understand (just about EVERYTHING)...:roll:

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PostPosted: Sun May 18, 2014 11:33 pm 
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Disco Boy wrote:
That's NOT the complete transcript.

Btw, I see nothing wrong with Nigel's comments.



You do know what "best of" means, right?

But then again, I don't think you're very bright. So I'm not surprised why you'd think there was something wrong with his comments or the "best of" clip I posted.

Typical socialists - always upset at things they don't even understand (just about EVERYTHING)...:roll:


Disco Boy's brightness shines through again. He now wants entire transcripts of 19 minute interviews if a summary of someone's words is to be proved. At the same time, he believes it possible to sum up Frank Zappa's beliefs with a quote from 3 seconds of an interview.

Since he sees nothing wrong with Farage's statements above, appears to regard him as an intellectual giant, struggling with complex concepts and doesn't agree that there might be a mixture of hypocrisy and racism involved, perhaps he concurs with the following examples of political wizardry, made by Farage and members of his party, UKIP, too:

"Since the passage of the Marriage (Same Sex Couples) Act, the nation has been beset by serious storms and floods. One recent one caused the worst flooding for 60 years. The Christmas floods were the worst for 127 years. Is this just global warming or is there something more serious at work?" David Silvester (UKIP Councillor)
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/ukips-top-10-m ... re-1433098

Douglas Denny, from the UKIP branch in Bognor Regis on homosexuals: "I just wish they would keep their ­homosexual nature and practices to ­themselves and stop trying to ram it down my throat telling me they are 'normal' when they are not."
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/ukips-top-10-m ... re-1433098

"[Some people find homosexuality] distasteful if not viscerally repugnant... Different people may have different tastes. You may tell me that you don’t like Earl Grey tea. That may be a minority view but you are entitled not to like it if you don’t like it." Roger Helmer, UKIP candidate.
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/ukips-top-10-m ... re-1433098

“I rather often wonder if we shot one “poofter” (GLBT whatevers), whether the next 99 would decide on balance, that they weren’t after-all? We might then conclude that it’s not a matter of genetics, but rather more of education” John Sullivan, UKIP candidate.
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2014/05/16/vi ... o-be-shot/

Referring to economic aid to Africa, UKIP MEP Godfrey Bloom stated the following: "How we can possibly be giving £1bn a month, when we're in this sort of debt, to Bongo Bongo Land is completely beyond me."
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/ukips-top-10-m ... re-1433098

On being the butt of jokes from comedian Lenny Henry, William Henwood, UKIP candidate in Enfield responded: “He (Henry) should emigrate to a black country. He does not have to live with whites.”
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/ho ... 93040.html

One my favourites is UKIP candidate Kevin O'Doherty who, apart from posing naked with a male friend with Nazi tattoos, apparently sniffing cocaine from a naked teenager's bottom, also suggested "There is no such thing as a benign Muslim, only a latent adherent of Koranic dogma”
http://politicalscrapbook.net/2014/05/n ... ook_featt4
and...
http://www.hastingsobserver.co.uk/news/ ... -1-6035107

And the wonderful Farage himself is prepared to sacrifice economic success for a stop on immigration: "If you said to me, would I like to see over the next ten years a further five million people come in to Britain and if that happened we’d all be slightly richer, I’d say, I’d rather we weren’t slightly richer, and I’d rather we had communities that were united and where young unemployed British people had a realistic chance of getting a job.
I think the social side of this matters more than pure market economics.”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... -says.html

Here's Farage on women who work: "In many, many cases, women make different choices in life to the ones that men make simply for biological reasons... If a woman has a client base and has a child and takes two or three years off work, she is worth far less to the employer when she comes back than when she goes away because her client base cannot be stuck rigidly to her."
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/j ... nance-ukip

However, Farage is at least realistic on his chances of receiving votes from ethnic minorities : "We will never win the nigger vote. The nig-nogs will never vote for us.”
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -jibe.html

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Last edited by Caputh on Mon May 19, 2014 12:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 12:19 am 
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Caputh wrote:
However, Farage is at least realistic on his chances of receiving votes from ethnic minorities : "We will never win the nigger vote. The nig-nogs will never vote for us.”
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -jibe.html
Denial Boy wrote:
Btw, I see nothing wrong with Nigel's comments.


Go figure. :roll:

SPACEBROTHER wrote:
Caputh wrote:
SPACEBROTHER wrote:
What specific social policies, votes and platforms of Ron Paul, Rand Paul and the Libertarian party attracts white supremacist groups, terrorist militia groups and kooky conspiracy theorists?


How 'bout you rephrase the question - then he might answer it.

I'll give it a go...

"What specific social policies, votes and platforms of Ron Paul, Rand Paul and the Libertarian party attracts people of segregationist, non-conformist, anti-establishment and possibly subversive viewpoints?"


Meanwhile, Denial Boy is still dodging the question...


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 8:39 am 
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SPACEBROTHER wrote:
Caputh wrote:
However, Farage is at least realistic on his chances of receiving votes from ethnic minorities : "We will never win the nigger vote. The nig-nogs will never vote for us.”
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -jibe.html
Denial Boy wrote:
Btw, I see nothing wrong with Nigel's comments.


Go figure. :roll:



BTW Farage denies having said the above. Mind you, if I'd used those words (which I wouldn't), I think I'd have denied it as well. The original source for the above quote is Eurosceptic Dr Alan Sked, a respected professor of history and former member of UKIP, who left the party after stating: " They are racist and have been infected by the far-right." He also stated that: "UKIP's MEPs are a standing joke at Strasbourg, where their attendance record, even by the standards of most MEPs, is relatively poor and where, according to independent research by the European Studies centre at the London School of Economics, the three often vote in different ways on the same issue."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Sked

Funny how UKIP has also recently lost its only prominent British Asian member, Sanya-Jeet Thandi, who left claiming: "UKIP has descended into a form of racist populism that I cannot bring myself to vote for. This week I decided to leave the party and I will abstain from voting in the upcoming European elections. I urge other UKIP supporters to do the same."
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... eet-thandi

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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 11:57 am 
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There seems to be no limits to the level and frequency of denial by the Libertarian Right in regards to blatant racism and fascism.

Meanwhile, Denial Boy is still avoiding the question...

What specific social policies, votes and platforms of Ron Paul, Rand Paul and the Libertarian party attracts white supremacist groups, terrorist militia groups and kooky conspiracy theorists?

or the version by Caputh...

"What specific social policies, votes and platforms of Ron Paul, Rand Paul and the Libertarian party attracts people of segregationist, non-conformist, anti-establishment and possibly subversive viewpoints?"


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 3:37 pm 
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You are dumb as fuck, SPACEBROTHER forum entity. Your inquiry has been answered more than once. The policy is FREEDOM. The freedom to be a segragationist, a non-conformist (like Frank Zappa), anti-establishment (like Frank Zappa), and subversive (like Frank Zappa).

If you want to see a fascist, look in the mirror. There's a racist there, too. Freedom means being what you are, and endeavoring to be what you want to be, even if you want to be a non-conformist, racist, Nazi asshole. That's freedom, dumbass...you have to let people be what they are and what they wish. Conforming to YOUR narrow view of how things should be is not freedom, it's fascism.

I'm not a segregationist, but I know some folks who are. They have not been arrested. Racism is not illegal, nor is non-conformity, nor is antiestablishmentarianism, nor is subversion, unless it is pinned as sedition. I for one would not like to be known as a government bootlick, or a person that cheers on the Federal government as it continues to destroy the nation.

Freedom is the policy that attracts voters to Ron Paul. Is that specific enough for you, or do you think there is some hidden agenda to bring back slavery or segregation?

Your problem, SPACEBROTHER forum entity, is that you see an older white guy and you automatically think "racist". That's racist.

Ron Paul is not a racist. His policies do not include racism. There is no large movement toward racism or oppression of "minorities" in this country, and you know it...but you kind of wish there was, don't you? Then you could express your hatred in more forceful ways.

The fact is, the ball has been in your court for several years now, and what do we have? More of the same old bullshit wars and "programs". It's the same as it ever was, and it has nothing to do with conservative or liberal policies, but everything to do with big money controlling everything.

The way I see it, you would love to have all the old white guys oppressed and punished...maybe put them in camps, eh?

You don't have a clue as to what freedom is...your all full of doublespeak...war is peace, conformity is freedom. If conformity means being a government-loving shrill little asswipe, then give me death.


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 5:31 pm 
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Good post .

It always makes when wonder if some people will ever be satisfied . :?
Then again , being a quasi - martyr for certain causes could become a way of life for some.
:wink:


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 8:11 pm 
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Caputh wrote:
Disco Boy wrote:
That's NOT the complete transcript.

Btw, I see nothing wrong with Nigel's comments.



You do know what "best of" means, right?

But then again, I don't think you're very bright. So I'm not surprised why you'd think there was something wrong with his comments or the "best of" clip I posted.

Typical socialists - always upset at things they don't even understand (just about EVERYTHING)...:roll:


Disco Boy's brightness shines through again. He now wants entire transcripts of 19 minute interviews if a summary of someone's words is to be proved. At the same time, he believes it possible to sum up Frank Zappa's beliefs with a quote from 3 seconds of an interview.


Caputh's idiocy GLARES through once again. Quoting someone PROPERLY is important whenever you're trying to make a point. But instead, to fit his own socialist agenda, he picks misquotes to try and reinforce his points that ultimately go nowhere, as usual.

At the same time, he denies the OVERWHELMING evidence (not just a 3 second clip) that I've posted MULTIPLE times, very clearly showing that most of FZ's beliefs were Libertarian-based.

Caputh wrote:
Since he sees nothing wrong with Farage's statements above, appears to regard him as an intellectual giant, struggling with complex concepts and doesn't agree that there might be a mixture of hypocrisy and racism involved, perhaps he concurs with the following examples of political wizardry, made by Farage and members of his party, UKIP, too:

"Since the passage of the Marriage (Same Sex Couples) Act, the nation has been beset by serious storms and floods. One recent one caused the worst flooding for 60 years. The Christmas floods were the worst for 127 years. Is this just global warming or is there something more serious at work?" David Silvester (UKIP Councillor)
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/ukips-top-10-m ... re-1433098

Douglas Denny, from the UKIP branch in Bognor Regis on homosexuals: "I just wish they would keep their ­homosexual nature and practices to ­themselves and stop trying to ram it down my throat telling me they are 'normal' when they are not."
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/ukips-top-10-m ... re-1433098

"[Some people find homosexuality] distasteful if not viscerally repugnant... Different people may have different tastes. You may tell me that you don’t like Earl Grey tea. That may be a minority view but you are entitled not to like it if you don’t like it." Roger Helmer, UKIP candidate.
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/ukips-top-10-m ... re-1433098

“I rather often wonder if we shot one “poofter” (GLBT whatevers), whether the next 99 would decide on balance, that they weren’t after-all? We might then conclude that it’s not a matter of genetics, but rather more of education” John Sullivan, UKIP candidate.
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2014/05/16/vi ... o-be-shot/

Referring to economic aid to Africa, UKIP MEP Godfrey Bloom stated the following: "How we can possibly be giving £1bn a month, when we're in this sort of debt, to Bongo Bongo Land is completely beyond me."
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/ukips-top-10-m ... re-1433098

On being the butt of jokes from comedian Lenny Henry, William Henwood, UKIP candidate in Enfield responded: “He (Henry) should emigrate to a black country. He does not have to live with whites.”
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/ho ... 93040.html

One my favourites is UKIP candidate Kevin O'Doherty who, apart from posing naked with a male friend with Nazi tattoos, apparently sniffing cocaine from a naked teenager's bottom, also suggested "There is no such thing as a benign Muslim, only a latent adherent of Koranic dogma”
http://politicalscrapbook.net/2014/05/n ... ook_featt4
and...
http://www.hastingsobserver.co.uk/news/ ... -1-6035107


So because there are SOME former UKIP members/candidates that are either racist or who say stupid things, that that automatically discredits the entire party?! Farage has already covered the elimination of said members/candidates in the initial video clip you provided. So I have no idea why you post quotes (whether they're correct or in context or not, I don't know?!) from these particular people?!

Caputh wrote:
And the wonderful Farage himself is prepared to sacrifice economic success for a stop on immigration: "If you said to me, would I like to see over the next ten years a further five million people come in to Britain and if that happened we’d all be slightly richer, I’d say, I’d rather we weren’t slightly richer, and I’d rather we had communities that were united and where young unemployed British people had a realistic chance of getting a job.
I think the social side of this matters more than pure market economics.”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... -says.html

Here's Farage on women who work: "In many, many cases, women make different choices in life to the ones that men make simply for biological reasons... If a woman has a client base and has a child and takes two or three years off work, she is worth far less to the employer when she comes back than when she goes away because her client base cannot be stuck rigidly to her."
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/j ... nance-ukip


I don't see anything wrong with the above statements. And if you truly think those comments are racist or sexist, then you're a complete fucking idiot.

Caputh wrote:
However, Farage is at least realistic on his chances of receiving votes from ethnic minorities : "We will never win the nigger vote. The nig-nogs will never vote for us.”
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -jibe.html


Nigel Farage did NOT state that, you little weasel.

tweedle-dumb wrote:
Caputh wrote:
However, Farage is at least realistic on his chances of receiving votes from ethnic minorities : "We will never win the nigger vote. The nig-nogs will never vote for us.”
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -jibe.html
Denial Boy wrote:
Btw, I see nothing wrong with Nigel's comments.


Go figure. :roll:


Yet ANOTHER misquote.

tweedle-dumb wrote:
Caputh wrote:
tweedle-dumb wrote:
What specific social policies, votes and platforms of Ron Paul, Rand Paul and the Libertarian party attracts white supremacist groups, terrorist militia groups and kooky conspiracy theorists?


How 'bout you rephrase the question - then he might answer it.

I'll give it a go...

"What specific social policies, votes and platforms of Ron Paul, Rand Paul and the Libertarian party attracts people of segregationist, non-conformist, anti-establishment and possibly subversive viewpoints?"


Meanwhile, Denial Boy is still dodging the question...

There seems to be no limits to the level and frequency of denial by the Libertarian Right in regards to blatant racism and fascism.


There seems to be no limits to the level of ultra-stupidity you exude...

A rope leash wrote:
You are dumb as fuck, SPACEBROTHER forum entity. Your inquiry has been answered more than once. The policy is FREEDOM. The freedom to be a segragationist, a non-conformist (like Frank Zappa), anti-establishment (like Frank Zappa), and subversive (like Frank Zappa).

If you want to see a fascist, look in the mirror. There's a racist there, too. Freedom means being what you are, and endeavoring to be what you want to be, even if you want to be a non-conformist, racist, Nazi asshole. That's freedom, dumbass...you have to let people be what they are and what they wish. Conforming to YOUR narrow view of how things should be is not freedom, it's fascism.

I'm not a segregationist, but I know some folks who are. They have not been arrested. Racism is not illegal, nor is non-conformity, nor is antiestablishmentarianism, nor is subversion, unless it is pinned as sedition. I for one would not like to be known as a government bootlick, or a person that cheers on the Federal government as it continues to destroy the nation.

Freedom is the policy that attracts voters to Ron Paul. Is that specific enough for you, or do you think there is some hidden agenda to bring back slavery or segregation?

Your problem, SPACEBROTHER forum entity, is that you see an older white guy and you automatically think "racist". That's racist.

Ron Paul is not a racist. His policies do not include racism. There is no large movement toward racism or oppression of "minorities" in this country, and you know it...but you kind of wish there was, don't you? Then you could express your hatred in more forceful ways.

The fact is, the ball has been in your court for several years now, and what do we have? More of the same old bullshit wars and "programs". It's the same as it ever was, and it has nothing to do with conservative or liberal policies, but everything to do with big money controlling everything.

The way I see it, you would love to have all the old white guys oppressed and punished...maybe put them in camps, eh?

You don't have a clue as to what freedom is...your all full of doublespeak...war is peace, conformity is freedom. If conformity means being a government-loving shrill little asswipe, then give me death.


Well put.

And thank you.

_________________
:53 - :57...

"...I'm absolutely a Libertarian on MANY issues..." ~ Frank Zappa, Rochester, NY, March 11, 1988


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 10:42 pm 
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Location: in deepest, darkest Germany
Disco Boy wrote:
Caputh's idiocy GLARES through once again. Quoting someone PROPERLY is important whenever you're trying to make a point. But instead, to fit his own socialist agenda, he picks misquotes to try and reinforce his points that ultimately go nowhere, as usual.

At the same time, he denies the OVERWHELMING evidence (not just a 3 second clip) that I've posted MULTIPLE times, very clearly showing that most of FZ's beliefs were Libertarian-based.


I actually quoted you quite accurately - or was there something important I missed? I also quoted Farage quite accurately on everything he said that had to do with my original summary of his views which you had incorrectly described as a misinterpretation.
Please provide a link to your transcription of the entire Frank Zappa interview contained in your signature that supports your view.

Disco Boy wrote:
So because there are SOME former UKIP members/candidates that are either racist or who say stupid things, that that automatically discredits the entire party?! Farage has already covered the elimination of said members/candidates in the initial video clip you provided. So I have no idea why you post quotes (whether they're correct or in context or not, I don't know?!) from these particular people?!


As Marta Andreasan, who quit UKIP in 2013, put it: "Under his leadership - and I have questioned his leadership obviously a number of times - the party has become a dictatorship. This is a Stalinist way of operating and he doesn't care about the membership or the grassroots."
She also claimed that Mr Farage did not want "intelligent, professional" women in key positions in the party."I am the only female MEP. He doesn't try to involve intelligent professional women in positions of responsibility in the party. He thinks women should be in the kitchen or in the bedroom."
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-21355197. Once again, Farage denies ever having said this.

BTW, as regards the expulsion of "idiots", three have resigned or been expelled since: Silvester, Henwood and Helmer. The rest are still there, although Godfrey retired for reasons of age in 2013, he's still one of Farage's best friends and main advisers. Farage is not standing for president. He is the leader of a party whom he represents and whose views he personally embodies. The fact that he bizarrely claims to have never heard of e.g. Silvester before in the LBC interview linked to above, even though he was an official UKIP candidate does not add to his credibility

I presume Farage is, however, aware of UKIP's present European election posters...
Image

The above proved racist enough for the British Asian UKIP candidate Sanya-Jeet Thandi, who resigned from the party as a result, but presumably, at least according to Disco Boy, she's just a "fucking idiot" for finding it so.

Caputh wrote:
However, Farage is at least realistic on his chances of receiving votes from ethnic minorities : "We will never win the nigger vote. The nig-nogs will never vote for us.”
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -jibe.html


Disco Boy wrote:
Nigel Farage did NOT state that, you little weasel.



Oh, he denies it, as I pointed out above, but I think he did. And so does Professor of History Dr. Alan Sked (to whom he said it) and the British PM, David Cameron.

I suppose it's hardly surprising that you fail to see the racist, homophobic and sexist elements in UKIP and Farage's views as you also failed to see the negative aspects of the politics in Mussolini's Italy, Pinochet's Chile and the Neo-Fascists in charge of Hungary or indeed the inhumanity of child labour in 19th century Britain.

In fact, in your particular, unique case I think SPACEBROTHER may have at last have received the answer to his question. So long as a party, movement, system or politician promotes your version of free-market capitalism you are prepared to condone, ignore, apologize and occasionally express support for any racist, homophobic, sexist, anti-democratic, repressive, exploitative, murderous policies they may otherwise propagate.
In fact, you are a mirror image of a so-called socialist trying to defend the government of North Korea, Stalin or Mao.
That's all I have to say about Farage...

_________________
"I have learned from my mistakes, and I am sure I can repeat them exactly."


Last edited by Caputh on Tue May 20, 2014 12:02 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 3:04 am 
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Posts: 3565
A rope leash wrote:
You are dumb as fuck, SPACEBROTHER forum entity. Your inquiry has been answered more than once. The policy is FREEDOM. The freedom to be a segragationist, a non-conformist (like Frank Zappa), anti-establishment (like Frank Zappa), and subversive (like Frank Zappa).

If you want to see a fascist, look in the mirror. There's a racist there, too. Freedom means being what you are, and endeavoring to be what you want to be, even if you want to be a non-conformist, racist, Nazi asshole. That's freedom, dumbass...you have to let people be what they are and what they wish. Conforming to YOUR narrow view of how things should be is not freedom, it's fascism.

I'm not a segregationist, but I know some folks who are. They have not been arrested. Racism is not illegal, nor is non-conformity, nor is antiestablishmentarianism, nor is subversion, unless it is pinned as sedition. I for one would not like to be known as a government bootlick, or a person that cheers on the Federal government as it continues to destroy the nation.

Freedom is the policy that attracts voters to Ron Paul. Is that specific enough for you, or do you think there is some hidden agenda to bring back slavery or segregation?

Your problem, SPACEBROTHER forum entity, is that you see an older white guy and you automatically think "racist". That's racist.

Ron Paul is not a racist. His policies do not include racism. There is no large movement toward racism or oppression of "minorities" in this country, and you know it...but you kind of wish there was, don't you? Then you could express your hatred in more forceful ways.

The fact is, the ball has been in your court for several years now, and what do we have? More of the same old bullshit wars and "programs". It's the same as it ever was, and it has nothing to do with conservative or liberal policies, but everything to do with big money controlling everything.

The way I see it, you would love to have all the old white guys oppressed and punished...maybe put them in camps, eh?

You don't have a clue as to what freedom is...your all full of doublespeak...war is peace, conformity is freedom. If conformity means being a government-loving shrill little asswipe, then give me death.


mutherfuckin' BRAVO!


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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 10:36 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 05, 2006 11:11 pm
Posts: 3606
Location: Vancouver, BC
Caputh wrote:
Disco Boy wrote:
Caputh's idiocy GLARES through once again. Quoting someone PROPERLY is important whenever you're trying to make a point. But instead, to fit his own socialist agenda, he picks misquotes to try and reinforce his points that ultimately go nowhere, as usual.

At the same time, he denies the OVERWHELMING evidence (not just a 3 second clip) that I've posted MULTIPLE times, very clearly showing that most of FZ's beliefs were Libertarian-based.


I actually quoted you quite accurately - or was there something important I missed?


I wasn't referring to me.

Caputh wrote:
I also quoted Farage quite accurately on everything he said that had to do with my original summary of his views which you had incorrectly described as a misinterpretation.


No, you did NOT quote him properly regarding that issue. And anyone who's watched that clip knows it. STOP BS'in...

Caputh wrote:
Please provide a link to your transcription of the entire Frank Zappa interview contained in your signature that supports your view.


That isn't necessary, asshole. Anyone can view the clip and see what FZ stated accurately.

Caputh wrote:
Disco Boy wrote:
So because there are SOME former UKIP members/candidates that are either racist or who say stupid things, that that automatically discredits the entire party?! Farage has already covered the elimination of said members/candidates in the initial video clip you provided. So I have no idea why you post quotes (whether they're correct or in context or not, I don't know?!) from these particular people?!


As Marta Andreasan, who quit UKIP in 2013, put it: "Under his leadership - and I have questioned his leadership obviously a number of times - the party has become a dictatorship. This is a Stalinist way of operating and he doesn't care about the membership or the grassroots."
She also claimed that Mr Farage did not want "intelligent, professional" women in key positions in the party."I am the only female MEP. He doesn't try to involve intelligent professional women in positions of responsibility in the party. He thinks women should be in the kitchen or in the bedroom."
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-21355197. Once again, Farage denies ever having said this.

BTW, as regards the expulsion of "idiots", three have resigned or been expelled since: Silvester, Henwood and Helmer. The rest are still there, although Godfrey retired for reasons of age in 2013, he's still one of Farage's best friends and main advisers. Farage is not standing for president. He is the leader of a party whom he represents and whose views he personally embodies. The fact that he bizarrely claims to have never heard of e.g. Silvester before in the LBC interview linked to above, even though he was an official UKIP candidate does not add to his credibility.


Prove that these particular racists are still with UKIP and that Godfrey is one of Farage's "best friends."

Caputh wrote:
I presume Farage is, however, aware of UKIP's present European election posters...
Image

The above proved racist enough for the British Asian UKIP candidate Sanya-Jeet Thandi, who resigned from the party as a result, but presumably, at least according to Disco Boy, she's just a "fucking idiot" for finding it so.


Are you fucking kidding me?! How is that poster racist?!

And NO, I did NOT call her a "fucking idiot." I called YOU one.

Caputh wrote:
Caputh wrote:
However, Farage is at least realistic on his chances of receiving votes from ethnic minorities : "We will never win the nigger vote. The nig-nogs will never vote for us.”
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -jibe.html


Disco Boy wrote:
Nigel Farage did NOT state that, you little weasel.



Oh, he denies it, as I pointed out above, but I think he did. And so does Professor of History Dr. Alan Sked (to whom he said it) and the British PM, David Cameron.


Until it's proven he stated it, it does NOTHING to realistically discredit him. So again, why are you posting it?!

Caputh wrote:
I suppose it's hardly surprising that you fail to see the racist, homophobic and sexist elements in UKIP and Farage's views as you also failed to see the negative aspects of the politics in Mussolini's Italy, Pinochet's Chile and the Neo-Fascists in charge of Hungary or indeed the inhumanity of child labour in 19th century Britain.

In fact, in your particular, unique case I think SPACEBROTHER may have at last have received the answer to his question. So long as a party, movement, system or politician promotes your version of free-market capitalism you are prepared to condone, ignore, apologize and occasionally express support for any racist, homophobic, sexist, anti-democratic, repressive, exploitative, murderous policies they may otherwise propagate.
In fact, you are a mirror image of a so-called socialist trying to defend the government of North Korea, Stalin or Mao.
That's all I have to say about Farage...


I suppose it's hardly surprising you fail to see that you've CONVENIENTLY forgotten that I've already stated SOME former UKIP members/candidates are indeed racist and that I've already explicitly gone over the negative and positive aspects of the other subjects you've mentioned above MONTHS AGO.

But of course, since it doesn't fit into your incredibly parochial socialistic mindset, you need to keep mudslinging, misquoting, misinterpreting & dragging particular statements into the equation that have NOTHING to do with successfully discrediting Farage or myself, in order to somehow reinforce your erroneous position.

But then again, that's your shtick. Verbosity-induced-diarrhoea-rhetoric at its finest.

I wouldn't expect anything less from you... :roll:

_________________
:53 - :57...

"...I'm absolutely a Libertarian on MANY issues..." ~ Frank Zappa, Rochester, NY, March 11, 1988


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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 7:43 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 22, 2008 9:19 am
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Location: in deepest, darkest Germany
A last UKIP post (ha, I'm not very good at keeping promises).




1. Compare and contrast.:
a) Austrian Nazi propaganda from 1933
Image
http://www.bildarchivaustria.at/Bildarc ... 802617.jpg

The translation of the text on the banner on the truck reads: "500 000 unemployed. 400 000 Jews. [The] solution [is] quite simple! Vote National Socialist!"



b) UKIP's current election poster, which caused Asian British UKIP member Sanya-Jeet Thandi (who, according to Disco Boy, is not a "fucking idiot") to leave the party, claiming "UKIP has descended into a form of racist populism that I cannot bring myself to vote for..."

Image

She continues: "The above poster epitomises where the party is going wrong. This anti-immigrant campaign undermines UKIP's claim not to be a racist party. They are turning the election into a game of "us" and "them". Well, I am with "them"...UKIP is exploiting the stupidity of ignorant anti-immigrant voters for electoral gain. While the party deliberately attracts the racist vote, I refuse to be associated with them."
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... -the-party


2. Compare and contrast statement a) with statement b):

a) "Ich hatte tatsächlich kein Gefühl der Abneigung gegen sie [die Juden] oder besser, nicht mehr als jeder von uns so etwas wie ein unangenehmes Gefühl manchmal im Umgang mit ihnen hat."

Translation: "I really did not have a feeling of dislike towards them [the Jews], not more than the uncomfortable feeling every one of us has, when one comes in contact with them sometimes."

(Albert Speer, Nazi Minister for Armaments, responsible for the deportation of Berlin's Jews and their use as slave labourers, letter to his daughter, 1953. Quoted in: "Albert Speer-das Ringen um die Wahrheit" by Gitta Sereny, Berlin 1995, p. 116.)

b) Farage: "I made the point that I got on a train and went for several stops and there were lot of people around me and no one spoke English and I didn't object to it, I felt slightly uncomfortable. I think, actually, isn't that the problem? Isn't this of all the all countries in Europe the most accepting the most tolerant..."

O'Brien: "You said I don't feel very comfortable in that situation. You did say you had a problem."

Farage: "I didn't feel comfortable, no."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niWSEn5NNAE


3. Evaluate the legitimacy of Farage's position:

"Here's the bigger question. Do we think, chaps, when we're there in the front line, when the balloon goes up, with fixed bayonets, when the whistle's about to blow to go over the top, do we actually want to be there with women beside us? Do we? What an extraordinarily bizarre idea! I certainly don't think so...But maybe it's because I've got so many women pregnant over the years that I have a different view. I find it very difficult to think that we could stand up and run over the top together, into the machine guns or whatever. Men and women are different - thank God!"
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/05 ... 65144.html

_________________
"I have learned from my mistakes, and I am sure I can repeat them exactly."


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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 5:35 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jul 30, 2010 11:55 pm
Posts: 2342
A rope leash wrote:
You are dumb as fuck, SPACEBROTHER forum entity. Your inquiry has been answered more than once. The policy is FREEDOM. The freedom to be a segragationist, a non-conformist (like Frank Zappa), anti-establishment (like Frank Zappa), and subversive (like Frank Zappa).

If you want to see a fascist, look in the mirror. There's a racist there, too. Freedom means being what you are, and endeavoring to be what you want to be, even if you want to be a non-conformist, racist, Nazi asshole. That's freedom, dumbass...you have to let people be what they are and what they wish. Conforming to YOUR narrow view of how things should be is not freedom, it's fascism.

I'm not a segregationist, but I know some folks who are. They have not been arrested. Racism is not illegal, nor is non-conformity, nor is antiestablishmentarianism, nor is subversion, unless it is pinned as sedition. I for one would not like to be known as a government bootlick, or a person that cheers on the Federal government as it continues to destroy the nation.

Freedom is the policy that attracts voters to Ron Paul. Is that specific enough for you, or do you think there is some hidden agenda to bring back slavery or segregation?

Your problem, SPACEBROTHER forum entity, is that you see an older white guy and you automatically think "racist". That's racist.

Ron Paul is not a racist. His policies do not include racism. There is no large movement toward racism or oppression of "minorities" in this country, and you know it...but you kind of wish there was, don't you? Then you could express your hatred in more forceful ways.

The fact is, the ball has been in your court for several years now, and what do we have? More of the same old bullshit wars and "programs". It's the same as it ever was, and it has nothing to do with conservative or liberal policies, but everything to do with big money controlling everything.

The way I see it, you would love to have all the old white guys oppressed and punished...maybe put them in camps, eh?

You don't have a clue as to what freedom is...your all full of doublespeak...war is peace, conformity is freedom. If conformity means being a government-loving shrill little asswipe, then give me death.


Rope is unbeatable when he's focused and on point. Even DB can't fuck with him and I hope Rope agrees that U2 sucks donkey balls.


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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 6:43 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 05, 2006 11:11 pm
Posts: 3606
Location: Vancouver, BC
Caputh wrote:
A last UKIP post (ha, I'm not very good at keeping promises).




1. Compare and contrast.:
a) Austrian Nazi propaganda from 1933
Image
http://www.bildarchivaustria.at/Bildarc ... 802617.jpg

The translation of the text on the banner on the truck reads: "500 000 unemployed. 400 000 Jews. [The] solution [is] quite simple! Vote National Socialist!"



b) UKIP's current election poster, which caused Asian British UKIP member Sanya-Jeet Thandi (who, according to Disco Boy, is not a "fucking idiot") to leave the party, claiming "UKIP has descended into a form of racist populism that I cannot bring myself to vote for..."

Image

She continues: "The above poster epitomises where the party is going wrong. This anti-immigrant campaign undermines UKIP's claim not to be a racist party. They are turning the election into a game of "us" and "them". Well, I am with "them"...UKIP is exploiting the stupidity of ignorant anti-immigrant voters for electoral gain. While the party deliberately attracts the racist vote, I refuse to be associated with them."
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... -the-party


Again, there is NO racist message, imagery or even subtext in the UKIP poster you posted. You're reading into this way too much and desperately grabbing at straws...


Caputh wrote:
2. Compare and contrast statement a) with statement b):

a) "Ich hatte tatsächlich kein Gefühl der Abneigung gegen sie [die Juden] oder besser, nicht mehr als jeder von uns so etwas wie ein unangenehmes Gefühl manchmal im Umgang mit ihnen hat."

Translation: "I really did not have a feeling of dislike towards them [the Jews], not more than the uncomfortable feeling every one of us has, when one comes in contact with them sometimes."

(Albert Speer, Nazi Minister for Armaments, responsible for the deportation of Berlin's Jews and their use as slave labourers, letter to his daughter, 1953. Quoted in: "Albert Speer-das Ringen um die Wahrheit" by Gitta Sereny, Berlin 1995, p. 116.)

b) Farage: "I made the point that I got on a train and went for several stops and there were lot of people around me and no one spoke English and I didn't object to it, I felt slightly uncomfortable. I think, actually, isn't that the problem? Isn't this of all the all countries in Europe the most accepting the most tolerant..."

O'Brien: "You said I don't feel very comfortable in that situation. You did say you had a problem."

Farage: "I didn't feel comfortable, no."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niWSEn5NNAE


You do realize he stated, "...I didn't object to it...", don't you?

And once again, you misquote him and don't provide the proper context. In other words, you change the goal posts so that they fit your point of view more conveniently.

Btw, I don't necessarily see anything wrong with what he said.

Caputh wrote:
3. Evaluate the legitimacy of Farage's position:

"Here's the bigger question. Do we think, chaps, when we're there in the front line, when the balloon goes up, with fixed bayonets, when the whistle's about to blow to go over the top, do we actually want to be there with women beside us? Do we? What an extraordinarily bizarre idea! I certainly don't think so...But maybe it's because I've got so many women pregnant over the years that I have a different view. I find it very difficult to think that we could stand up and run over the top together, into the machine guns or whatever. Men and women are different - thank God!"
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/05 ... 65144.html


Again, I don't necessarily see anything wrong with what he said. I wouldn't want women to engage in wars either. Does that make me sexist?!


Caputh, this is getting ridiculous now. I mean, REALLY fucking ridiculous. :roll:

_________________
:53 - :57...

"...I'm absolutely a Libertarian on MANY issues..." ~ Frank Zappa, Rochester, NY, March 11, 1988


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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2014 2:59 am 
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What you fail to understand DB, is that racism is not about whether you or I find something racist. It is about whether the particular group the accusation is made against finds it justifiably racist. I have already quoted one example of one ex-member of UKIP from an ethnic minority who finds this to be the case. There are many others from minority groups who feel the same way. In some ways, they could argue that the Nazi slogan is less racist IMO. It states a statistic and leaves one to draw one's own conclusion. The UKIP poster, on the other hand, makes the totally fallacious suggestion that 26 million unemployed EU foreigners are about to descend specifically on Britain (which already has the some of the strongest anti-immigration laws and controls in the EU) to take Briton's jobs away from them. They are thus engaging in irrational fear mongering against non-Britons and collectivizing them in a prejudicial fashion.

Farage's tactic of propounding racism lite in the media, whilst leading a party that contains a large amount of members with highly racist, homophobic and sexist sentiments, I find equally abhorrent and also find it quite well reflected by the "civilized" racism of Albert Speer. He also liked to pose as "the Good Nazi".

If you believe that you can justify a woman's professional choice on the grounds that you have made so many of them pregnant, then I wish you luck on your next blind date. Sooner or later, you're bound to score. :wink:

You're right, though. This is getting ridiculous. So ridiculous in fact, that if UKIP gets a majority of British seats in the EU elections today, as some are suggesting, and continues influencing politics in the UK, I will be forced to change my nationality from British to German. Firstly, on purely practical grounds, as if the UK withdraws from the European Union I will no longer be legally entitled to my job. Secondly, I wouldn't want to be in any way associated with a country that votes such a party into a position of any power. Thirdly, it will IMO further accelerate Britain's slow decline into a third or even fourth rate nation.

The result of Farage's policies, if realised, will thus make life difficult for both myself my wife and children, my parents - who live in France- and the rest of my family, who like being visited and do not wish to be permanently professionally attached to the UK. There are a large number of other European people who are in the same situation. Perhaps that's why I'm reluctant to shut up about what a hypocritical, racist ouanquére (as the French and Steve Bell might put it) Farage is.

Speaking of Steve Bell, here's his take on UKIP...
Image

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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2014 7:31 pm 
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Caputh wrote:
What you fail to understand DB, is that racism is not about whether you or I find something racist. It is about whether the particular group the accusation is made against finds it justifiably racist. I have already quoted one example of one ex-member of UKIP from an ethnic minority who finds this to be the case. There are many others from minority groups who feel the same way. In some ways, they could argue that the Nazi slogan is less racist IMO. It states a statistic and leaves one to draw one's own conclusion. The UKIP poster, on the other hand, makes the totally fallacious suggestion that 26 million unemployed EU foreigners are about to descend specifically on Britain (which already has the some of the strongest anti-immigration laws and controls in the EU) to take Briton's jobs away from them. They are thus engaging in irrational fear mongering against non-Britons and collectivizing them in a prejudicial fashion.


Those are YOUR opinions based on YOUR interpretations. They certainly are NOT factual.

Caputh wrote:
Farage's tactic of propounding racism lite in the media, whilst leading a party that contains a large amount of members with highly racist, homophobic and sexist sentiments, I find equally abhorrent and also find it quite well reflected by the "civilized" racism of Albert Speer. He also liked to pose as "the Good Nazi".


You still haven't PROVEN that these particular racists/sexists are still with UKIP and that Godfrey is one of Farage's "best friends."

Caputh wrote:
If you believe that you can justify a woman's professional choice on the grounds that you have made so many of them pregnant, then I wish you luck on your next blind date. Sooner or later, you're bound to score. :wink:


His statement wasn't just based on that. He was also talking about not wanting women to engage in wars.

Caputh wrote:
You're right, though. This is getting ridiculous. So ridiculous in fact, that if UKIP gets a majority of British seats in the EU elections today, as some are suggesting, and continues influencing politics in the UK, I will be forced to change my nationality from British to German. Firstly, on purely practical grounds, as if the UK withdraws from the European Union I will no longer be legally entitled to my job. Secondly, I wouldn't want to be in any way associated with a country that votes such a party into a position of any power. Thirdly, it will IMO further accelerate Britain's slow decline into a third or even fourth rate nation.

The result of Farage's policies, if realised, will thus make life difficult for both myself my wife and children, my parents - who live in France- and the rest of my family, who like being visited and do not wish to be permanently professionally attached to the UK. There are a large number of other European people who are in the same situation. Perhaps that's why I'm reluctant to shut up about what a hypocritical, racist ouanquére (as the French and Steve Bell might put it) Farage is.

Speaking of Steve Bell, here's his take on UKIP...
Image


Nigel Farage is NOT a racist. And you cannot PROVE otherwise. And until you do, I would STFU if I were you. Because casually throwing accusations like that around, especially unproven ones, can get you in a lot of hot water.

The methods in which you use to extrapolate things is quite disgusting. You seriously need help...

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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2014 8:52 pm 
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Running baths for people are we now, DB?
Then all these people are in a lot of hot water, too. And they range from Left (e.g. The New Statesman, The Guardian) to Right (e.g. The Daily Mail, Ex-UKIP members).

How tiredness can cause racism
http://www.theguardian.com/science/brai ... ess-racism

Ed Miliband should say Nigel Farage is racist, black Labour MP says
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... -says.html

Is Ukip a party of bigots? Let's look at the evidence
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/20 ... k-evidence

Yvette Cooper and David Lammy attack Nigel Farage over 'racist' comments
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... avid-lammy

Nigel Farage branded 'racist' and 'fascist' by his teachers
http://www.theweek.co.uk/uk-news/58414/ ... z32VkwcpNC

'I left UKIP because it has become too racist,' says party's founder
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... z32Vl7R2tv

Why don't they just shut the fuck up?

Actually, the water seems a little tepid by the time it reaches me, as your boiler seems to be fired solely by your rather empty opinion that you believe him when he says he isn't a racist and everybody else is lying.

Unlike yourself, who saw nothing wrong in Farage's comments, even he himself has regretted the statements I have quoted:
"Mr Farage on Sunday said that he regretted the comments and blamed them on the fact that he was “tired”."
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... acist.html

How nice of you to be concerned about my mental health. Once again, it shows the consideration and empathy you spread wherever you go. When visiting the psychiatrist, what treatment do you think he'll suggest, when I breathlessly state: "I think Farage is a racist"?
Electric shocks? Antidepressants? A loop of "The Best Of Nigel Farage would only serve as aversion therapy for me, I'm afraid.

Or did you have a "Doctor, Doctor" joke in mind?
MAN: "Doctor, doctor; I keep thinking Farage is a racist!"
DOCTOR: "Get to the back of the queue" (or "cue" as DB would have it).

As to your question on which of those I quoted as homophobes or racists are still members of UKIP...

Douglas Denny ("I just wish they would keep their ­homosexual nature and practices to ­themselves and stop trying to ram it down my throat telling me they are 'normal' when they are not.") was a candidate in the local elections yesterday. (22nd of May 2014)
http://www.englishelections.org.uk/engl ... smouth.php

Roger Helmer ("[Some people find homosexuality] distasteful if not viscerally repugnant... Different people may have different tastes. You may tell me that you don’t like Earl Grey tea. That may be a minority view but you are entitled not to like it if you don’t like it.") is a bye-election candidate for UKIP. (6th of May 2014)
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 27582.html

Kevin O'Doherty (posed naked with a male friend with Nazi tattoos, apparently sniffing cocaine from a naked teenager's bottom, and suggested "There is no such thing as a benign Muslim, only a latent adherent of Koranic dogma”) is still a candidate for UKIP. (17th of May, 2014)
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/ukip-candidate ... al-1448981

John Sullivan ("I rather often wonder if we shot one “poofter” (GLBT whatevers), whether the next 99 would decide on balance, that they weren’t after-all? We might then conclude that it’s not a matter of genetics, but rather more of education”) has not been suspended or expelled after all, but Farage is considering "disciplining" him. (18th of May, 2014)
http://www.gloucestercitizen.co.uk/Nige ... story.html

As I pointed out above, Silvester, ("Since the passage of the Marriage (Same Sex Couples) Act, the nation has been beset by serious storms and floods. One recent one caused the worst flooding for 60 years. The Christmas floods were the worst for 127 years. Is this just global warming or is there something more serious at work?") has been "suspended" from the party. (3rd of May, 2014)
http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/473860 ... -suspended

William Henwood ("He (Henry) should emigrate to a black country. He does not have to live with whites.”) has resigned from the party, but remained on the ballot for UKIP at yesterday's council election. (23rd of May, 2014)
http://www.northlondon-today.co.uk/News ... %20Council

But hey, you were right about Godfrey ("Bongo-Bongo-Land-Who-Shared-A-Flat-In-Brussels-With-Farage") Bloom! :oops: The last I'd heard about him was in autumn, last year, where he was still singing Farage's praises. It now appears that he's gone off him a bit. He now states:
"Ukip have got a problem and that is you tend to inherit the politically correct lexicon and you start nodding in the direction of tokenism and it follows through for policy. They're slipping into political correctness.
I fear we may be drifting into a ‘don't frighten the horses' policy," he said, warning that the party was adopting an attitude of "let's go mainstream and let's do all the things the main parties do". (21st of May, 2014)
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/05 ... 63304.html.

Nigel ("We will never win the nigger vote. The nig-nogs will never vote for us.”) Farage still begs in the above article: "Please don't call us a racist party".

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PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 7:32 pm 
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Caputh wrote:
Running baths for people are we now, DB?
Then all these people are in a lot of hot water, too. And they range from Left (e.g. The New Statesman, The Guardian) to Right (e.g. The Daily Mail, Ex-UKIP members).

How tiredness can cause racism
http://www.theguardian.com/science/brai ... ess-racism

Ed Miliband should say Nigel Farage is racist, black Labour MP says
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... -says.html

Is Ukip a party of bigots? Let's look at the evidence
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/20 ... k-evidence

Yvette Cooper and David Lammy attack Nigel Farage over 'racist' comments
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... avid-lammy

Nigel Farage branded 'racist' and 'fascist' by his teachers
http://www.theweek.co.uk/uk-news/58414/ ... z32VkwcpNC

'I left UKIP because it has become too racist,' says party's founder
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... z32Vl7R2tv

Why don't they just shut the fuck up?

Actually, the water seems a little tepid by the time it reaches me, as your boiler seems to be fired solely by your rather empty opinion that you believe him when he says he isn't a racist and everybody else is lying.

Unlike yourself, who saw nothing wrong in Farage's comments, even he himself has regretted the statements I have quoted:
"Mr Farage on Sunday said that he regretted the comments and blamed them on the fact that he was “tired”."
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... acist.html

How nice of you to be concerned about my mental health. Once again, it shows the consideration and empathy you spread wherever you go. When visiting the psychiatrist, what treatment do you think he'll suggest, when I breathlessly state: "I think Farage is a racist"?
Electric shocks? Antidepressants? A loop of "The Best Of Nigel Farage would only serve as aversion therapy for me, I'm afraid.

Or did you have a "Doctor, Doctor" joke in mind?
MAN: "Doctor, doctor; I keep thinking Farage is a racist!"
DOCTOR: "Get to the back of the queue" (or "cue" as DB would have it).

As to your question on which of those I quoted as homophobes or racists are still members of UKIP...

Douglas Denny ("I just wish they would keep their ­homosexual nature and practices to ­themselves and stop trying to ram it down my throat telling me they are 'normal' when they are not.") was a candidate in the local elections yesterday. (22nd of May 2014)
http://www.englishelections.org.uk/engl ... smouth.php

Roger Helmer ("[Some people find homosexuality] distasteful if not viscerally repugnant... Different people may have different tastes. You may tell me that you don’t like Earl Grey tea. That may be a minority view but you are entitled not to like it if you don’t like it.") is a bye-election candidate for UKIP. (6th of May 2014)
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 27582.html

Kevin O'Doherty (posed naked with a male friend with Nazi tattoos, apparently sniffing cocaine from a naked teenager's bottom, and suggested "There is no such thing as a benign Muslim, only a latent adherent of Koranic dogma”) is still a candidate for UKIP. (17th of May, 2014)
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/ukip-candidate ... al-1448981

John Sullivan ("I rather often wonder if we shot one “poofter” (GLBT whatevers), whether the next 99 would decide on balance, that they weren’t after-all? We might then conclude that it’s not a matter of genetics, but rather more of education”) has not been suspended or expelled after all, but Farage is considering "disciplining" him. (18th of May, 2014)
http://www.gloucestercitizen.co.uk/Nige ... story.html

As I pointed out above, Silvester, ("Since the passage of the Marriage (Same Sex Couples) Act, the nation has been beset by serious storms and floods. One recent one caused the worst flooding for 60 years. The Christmas floods were the worst for 127 years. Is this just global warming or is there something more serious at work?") has been "suspended" from the party. (3rd of May, 2014)
http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/473860 ... -suspended

William Henwood ("He (Henry) should emigrate to a black country. He does not have to live with whites.”) has resigned from the party, but remained on the ballot for UKIP at yesterday's council election. (23rd of May, 2014)
http://www.northlondon-today.co.uk/News ... %20Council

But hey, you were right about Godfrey ("Bongo-Bongo-Land-Who-Shared-A-Flat-In-Brussels-With-Farage") Bloom! :oops: The last I'd heard about him was in autumn, last year, where he was still singing Farage's praises. It now appears that he's gone off him a bit. He now states:
"Ukip have got a problem and that is you tend to inherit the politically correct lexicon and you start nodding in the direction of tokenism and it follows through for policy. They're slipping into political correctness.
I fear we may be drifting into a ‘don't frighten the horses' policy," he said, warning that the party was adopting an attitude of "let's go mainstream and let's do all the things the main parties do". (21st of May, 2014)
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/05 ... 63304.html.


The above does NOT prove that ANY current members of UKIP are racist. Also, I don't see anything wrong with Nigel's Romanian comment, since it was relating to the immigration issue he was discussing. Unfortunately, there does seem to be a few homophobic members within the party. And I admit, that's not a good thing.

Caputh wrote:
Nigel ("We will never win the nigger vote. The nig-nogs will never vote for us.”) Farage still begs in the above article: "Please don't call us a racist party".


AGAIN, until you've PROVEN Nigel stated that, STFU. You've entered into libellous territory here, asshole. :roll:

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PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 11:08 pm 
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If I am libelling Farage then so is Dr Alan Sked (the founder of UKIP), who claims that Farage made the above statement. I wonder why Farage is not pursuing a libel case against him? As this is Sked's version of a private conversation and he did not tape it, this is purely a question of whom you believe. I tend to believe Sked- particularly in the context of Farage's own personal history and the context of his party.

Want some more racist UKIP candidates in the local elections last Thursday? (Spelling and punctuation does not appear to be one of their strong points, btw.)

Ken Chapman (UKIP candidate in Amber Valley, Derbyshire), referred to "Pakis", "Zulus" and "Darkies" and also stated: “Islam is a cancer that needs eradicating ­multiculturism does not work in this country clear them all off to the desert with their camals that’s their way of life.”

Joseph Quirk, UKIP candidate in S Tyneside has claimed that Jewish bankers financed Hitler, Soviet Communism, 9/11 and Israel, and says: “This doesn’t even scratch the surface...”

Aiden Benoit, UKIP candidate in Barnsley claimed: “Islam makes money on everything that is Halal certified which goes to their courses so everything you buy your giving money to Islam. so your paying for them and you don’t even no because they do not tell us!”
He also posted: “makes me sick the foreigners are lazy no every time how to get out of work cry rasits when it doesent go their way. they fill up houses, and the NHS and bring criminals here.
We dont need them! theirs lots of Enlish people that wont a job… send them all back."

Robert Brown, UKIP town councillor in Ramsey, Cambridgeshire wrote of "evil" Muslims, who "...need to become christians and I will do all that I can to help them to do so.”

Source:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/tr ... z32c9NFAgm
(17th of May 2014) (Includes a number of all new homophobic remarks too!)



I wonder when Farage is going to throw them all out?

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