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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 3:39 am 
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What is all the fuzz about, to begin with?

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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 4:03 am 
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Mr_Green_Genes wrote:
What is all the fuzz about, to begin with?

It reminds me of the 'monkey / banana / spray 'em with water / replace monkeys one by one' experiment. None of them eventually know why they are attacking the monkey trying to get the banana.
TT

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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 7:48 am 
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brainpang wrote:
The President has plenty of power. I'd say you are only 30% crazy to say he does not tho'!


I don't know of anything the president can do on his own (with no involvement of anyone else), that has a MAJOR impact on anything?

Thanks for giving me back 70% of my sanity though. :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 7:54 am 
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Uncle Bernie wrote:
It was futile to begin with, mate. Not one of us can compete with the Master Brain of the Universe. Alas, we have to continue living our ignorant lives in the shadow of his (or her) magnificence.


I really enjoy the sarcasm in your comments. I always get a chuckle reading them. :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 12:15 pm 
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Uncle Bernie wrote:
It was futile to begin with, mate. Not one of us can compete with the Master Brain of the Universe. Alas, we have to continue living our ignorant lives in the shadow of his (or her) magnificence.


I still blame that woman outside Biggleswade a bit, though.

Back to how crap capitalism is/is not and how the President is impotent/is extremely potent....

NOW!

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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 1:16 pm 
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I tell you the president is impotent. Without the help of fertility drugs, that fucker's shooting blanks all day long.


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 10:44 pm 
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The Forum Killed Arkay wrote:
No, I never said nor even implied the word "strictly".


I didn't say or imply you did. But regardless, your erroneous summary happened to be the type of economy you were describing. That's part of what I was pointing out.

brainpang wrote:
Disco Boy wrote:
What I'm talking about and advocating is free market-based (or mostly free markets) economies. Meaning, MINIMAL regulations would still be in existence.

But regardless, and unfortunately, not one of you understand how free market-based economies work. And almost every single sentence you've stated above proves that, ...


And you wonder why no one likes you. I guess this ends my attempt at starting a sincere dialogue.


Self Described Manipulative Shithead wrote:
Disco Boy wrote:
...because you damn well know you're wrong.


Once again DB's attempts to mind-meld with me land him in the brain of a little old lady somewhere outside Biggleswade.
(Sorry, I couldn't resist)


Translation:

I can't even come close to winning the debate to save my life, so I'll just throw more ad hominems at DB.

Taking my quotes out of context, COMPLETELY IGNORING the matter at hand, cherry-pick peripheral things that either have little or no importance, while throwing more ad hominems at me is becoming a way of life for you, isn't it...?


Btw, brainpang, you do NOT speak on behalf of everyone here, asshole.

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"...I'm absolutely a Libertarian on MANY issues..." ~ Frank Zappa, Rochester, NY, March 11, 1988


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:50 am 
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Philostopher wrote:
brainpang wrote:
The President has plenty of power. I'd say you are only 30% crazy to say he does not tho'!


I don't know of anything the president can do on his own (with no involvement of anyone else), that has a MAJOR impact on anything?

Thanks for giving me back 70% of my sanity though. :wink:


OKAY, in a nutshell, simplified of course.
first off, huge amounts of money are spent by powerful people to assure that an establishment figure wins the primary, one that won't rock the boat. then huge amounts of money are spent by powerful people to curry favor with a particular candidate...because the prez is gonna be massively powerful, permit or deny access to A, B, C, D, etc.
On a more direct policy front, I would ask the 13 members of the wedding party in Yemen that were murdered if they think Obama is powerful or not. He CAN stop it.
And appointees, of course. HUGE.
And then....what if the Prez got shit faced, went on teevee and told us to stop buying shit? heh heh


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:59 am 
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Disco Boy wrote:
The Forum Killed Arkay wrote:
No, I never said nor even implied the word "strictly".


I didn't say or imply you did. But regardless, your erroneous summary happened to be the type of economy you were describing. That's part of what I was pointing out.

brainpang wrote:
Disco Boy wrote:
What I'm talking about and advocating is free market-based (or mostly free markets) economies. Meaning, MINIMAL regulations would still be in existence.

But regardless, and unfortunately, not one of you understand how free market-based economies work. And almost every single sentence you've stated above proves that, ...


And you wonder why no one likes you. I guess this ends my attempt at starting a sincere dialogue.


Self Described Manipulative Shithead wrote:
Disco Boy wrote:
...because you damn well know you're wrong.


Once again DB's attempts to mind-meld with me land him in the brain of a little old lady somewhere outside Biggleswade.
(Sorry, I couldn't resist)


Translation:

I can't even come close to winning the debate to save my life, so I'll just throw more ad hominems at DB.

Taking my quotes out of context, COMPLETELY IGNORING the matter at hand, cherry-pick peripheral things that either have little or no importance, while throwing more ad hominems at me is becoming a way of life for you, isn't it...?


Btw, brainpang, you do NOT speak on behalf of everyone here, asshole.


I can understand why you are coiled like a snake but you do yourself no favors. That just doesn't seem to sink in.

Here, I will try one more time, because I am foolish. How would the MINIMAL regs work? How would corruption be reigned in and dealt with? (as in the regulators being industry lackeys, price-fixing, etcetera).


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 8:34 pm 
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brainpang wrote:
Disco Boy wrote:
Translation:

I can't even come close to winning the debate to save my life, so I'll just throw more ad hominems at DB.

Taking my quotes out of context, COMPLETELY IGNORING the matter at hand, cherry-pick peripheral things that either have little or no importance, while throwing more ad hominems at me is becoming a way of life for you, isn't it...?


Btw, brainpang, you do NOT speak on behalf of everyone here, asshole.


I can understand why you are coiled like a snake but you do yourself no favors. That just doesn't seem to sink in.

Here, I will try one more time, because I am foolish. How would the MINIMAL regs work? How would corruption be reigned in and dealt with? (as in the regulators being industry lackeys, price-fixing, etcetera).


Maybe if you rise above your hypocrisy for a moment and pay attention (though, I know that's an extremely difficult thing to do), you might be able to realize that your questions have already been answered...several times.

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"...I'm absolutely a Libertarian on MANY issues..." ~ Frank Zappa, Rochester, NY, March 11, 1988


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:23 pm 
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Goddamn.

Let's get back to U2....

U2 doesn't have a musical bone in their body. They are a product of ambition, record collecting and reading the rock press and its phony histories of the music. When U2 speaks they sound like '60s activists. The rock critic mafia have all but insured that only this type of band will gain massive $uccess because they have set rock culture's political agenda.


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 12:12 am 
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downer mydnyte wrote:
U2 doesn't have a musical bone in their body.

You are probably right about all but this sentence. And Clayton is the luckiest bass player ever, and Bono is a bellend etc.
But, the edge has always tried to be inventive with the guitar, and they have produced a sufficient number of decent tunes to keep me half interested in the singles album occasionally.
TT

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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:07 am 
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Disco Boy wrote:
Maybe if you rise above your hypocrisy for a moment and pay attention (though, I know that's an extremely difficult thing to do), you might be able to realize that your questions have already been answered...several times.


Ha! Ha ha ha ha ha! Ha ha ha. Ha!

Until we meet again (in person?), I leave you with:


The Irremediable Mental Sadness of the Terror of Hollow (Theme From Disco Boy)

http://emptynegative.bandcamp.com/


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:15 am 
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downer mydnyte wrote:
Goddamn.

Let's get back to U2....

U2 doesn't have a musical bone in their body. They are a product of ambition, record collecting and reading the rock press and its phony histories of the music. When U2 speaks they sound like '60s activists. The rock critic mafia have all but insured that only this type of band will gain massive $uccess because they have set rock culture's political agenda.


Well, all of this may be true, but it doesn't matter. They've already achieved massive success and are probably millionaires many times over. It's like saying there's lots of talk show hosts that were better than Oprah. So? She's worth billions. And she's still a poor host.

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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:16 am 
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brainpang wrote:
The Irremediable Mental Sadness of the Terror of Hollow (Theme From Disco Boy)
http://emptynegative.bandcamp.com/


I note they are from Spain. Are they Conservatives?

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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:33 pm 
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calvin2hikers wrote:
downer mydnyte wrote:
Goddamn.

Let's get back to U2....

U2 doesn't have a musical bone in their body. They are a product of ambition, record collecting and reading the rock press and its phony histories of the music. When U2 speaks they sound like '60s activists. The rock critic mafia have all but insured that only this type of band will gain massive $uccess because they have set rock culture's political agenda.


Well, all of this may be true, but it doesn't matter. They've already achieved massive success and are probably millionaires many times over. It's like saying there's lots of talk show hosts that were better than Oprah. So? She's worth billions. And she's still a poor host.


Oprah is the U2 of television.


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:53 pm 
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brainpang wrote:
Disco Boy wrote:
Maybe if you rise above your hypocrisy for a moment and pay attention (though, I know that's an extremely difficult thing to do), you might be able to realize that your questions have already been answered...several times.


Ha! Ha ha ha ha ha! Ha ha ha. Ha!

Until we meet again (in person?), I leave you with:


The Irremediable Mental Sadness of the Terror of Hollow (Theme From Disco Boy)

http://emptynegative.bandcamp.com/


So you're still not paying attention and don't realize that the questions you've posed have already been answered...several times?

I can't say I'm surprised...

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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:50 pm 
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If hypothetically a person was a devoted fan of the Irish rock band U2 and so by association it could be said a fan of their lead singer, one Mr. Bono. Would it be hypocritical of that person to then work for money since they were arguably probono?


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 12:58 am 
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Gray_Ghost wrote:
If hypothetically a person was a devoted fan of the Irish rock band U2 and so by association it could be said a fan of their lead singer, one Mr. Bono. Would it be hypocritical of that person to then work for money since they were arguably probono?

That's for Pro's for Bono to answer...if there is any.

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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 3:36 am 
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Disco Boy wrote:

So you're still not paying attention and don't realize that the questions you've posed have already been answered...several times?

I can't say I'm surprised...


I guess you mean this poorly written post?

DISCO: "You see, in a free market-based economy, there would be a MASSIVE amounts of competition, which would drastically reduce the percentage of corporations in existence and prevent the ability to corner and/or ultimately control the markets and hence would create a smaller slice of the economic pie for competitors, generally speaking...."

It doesn't answer my question. I am not arguing about theories. I guess this is just too Utopian for me. I can only speculate that you believe any negative aspects can be accepted as they serve the greater good? And I guess you would have to abolish the Fed first? Get to the root! How does one reign in the fraudulent ways of the banks? WHO gets a loan and WHO doesn't?


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 5:17 am 
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The US Government has the authority to print and circulate money. They gave this authority to a central bank, the Federal Reserve, in 1913, along about the same time the income tax was instituted.

The Federal Reserve is owned by private investors. All the money they print bears interest paid by the government. The money is not so much money as it is debt. Getting rid of the Fed would be a start of at least debt-free currency, which would be very stimulating. Read about what Iceland did to their bankers.

Whenever a pResident tries this, he dies. Imagine that.


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 8:31 am 
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A rope leash wrote:
The US Government has the authority to print and circulate money. They gave this authority to a central bank, the Federal Reserve, in 1913, along about the same time the income tax was instituted.

The Federal Reserve is owned by private investors. All the money they print bears interest paid by the government. The money is not so much money as it is debt. Getting rid of the Fed would be a start of at least debt-free currency, which would be very stimulating. Read about what Iceland did to their bankers.

Whenever a pResident tries this, he dies. Imagine that.

Completely agree! Although you should've used the word 'currency' instead of 'money'. There is a theory that Kennedy was killed because he tried to transfer power from the Fed to the US Treasury by replacing Federal Reserve Notes with Silver Certificates.


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 8:58 am 
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A rope leash wrote:
The US Government has the authority to print and circulate money. They gave this authority to a central bank, the Federal Reserve, in 1913, along about the same time the income tax was instituted.

The Federal Reserve is owned by private investors. All the money they print bears interest paid by the government. The money is not so much money as it is debt. Getting rid of the Fed would be a start of at least debt-free currency, which would be very stimulating. Read about what Iceland did to their bankers.

Whenever a pResident tries this, he dies. Imagine that.


As far as I understood it, Iceland re-nationalized the banks Kaupþing, Landsbanki, Glitnir and Icebank and nationalized the Straumur bank. Are you suggesting nationalizing the Fed? That would certainly be interesting, but (and I'm perfectly prepared to be disabused of this) - would it be a particularly capitalist move? Or are you suggesting abolishing a central bank altogether?

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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 9:02 pm 
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brainpang wrote:
Disco Boy wrote:

So you're still not paying attention and don't realize that the questions you've posed have already been answered...several times?

I can't say I'm surprised...


I guess you mean this poorly written post?


No. And it's not a poorly written post.

brainpang wrote:
DISCO: "You see, in a free market-based economy, there would be a MASSIVE amounts of competition, which would drastically reduce the percentage of corporations in existence and prevent the ability to corner and/or ultimately control the markets and hence would create a smaller slice of the economic pie for competitors, generally speaking...."

It doesn't answer my question. I am not arguing about theories. I guess this is just too Utopian for me. I can only speculate that you believe any negative aspects can be accepted as they serve the greater good? And I guess you would have to abolish the Fed first? Get to the root! How does one reign in the fraudulent ways of the banks? WHO gets a loan and WHO doesn't?


ONE. MORE. TIME. FOR. THE. WORLD.:

The questions you've posed have already been answered, genius. But you're not paying attention. I've been discussing this for nearly TWO YEARS now. :roll:

A rope leash wrote:
The US Government has the authority to print and circulate money. They gave this authority to a central bank, the Federal Reserve, in 1913, along about the same time the income tax was instituted.

The Federal Reserve is owned by private investors. All the money they print bears interest paid by the government. The money is not so much money as it is debt. Getting rid of the Fed would be a start of at least debt-free currency, which would be very stimulating. Read about what Iceland did to their bankers.

Whenever a pResident tries this, he dies. Imagine that.


BINGO!

And this is why you're probably my favourite poster.

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"...I'm absolutely a Libertarian on MANY issues..." ~ Frank Zappa, Rochester, NY, March 11, 1988


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 Post subject: Re: The Debate Thread
PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 1:24 am 
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Disco Boy wrote:
The questions you've posed have already been answered, genius. But you're not paying attention. I've been discussing this for nearly TWO YEARS now.


Okay, I will keep my eyes peeled for the book version (with Index): "the collected wit & wisdom of disco boy as posted on the zappa forum" on ebay and amazon. Doubt I will see it tho' as everything you have to say is lifted from somewhere else and you would be ridiculed as a lightweight. You have nothing new to say, in fact you seem devoid of personality, so it is just plain useless. But please do pat yourself on the back again!


INTERESTING ARTICLE by Brainpang
Bernard Mandeville and Consumerism’s Buzz
Before Ayn Rand or Adam Smith, capitalism's prophet was the author of "The Fable of the Bees."

http://www.theamericanconservative.com/ ... isms-buzz/


Last edited by brainpang on Thu Dec 19, 2013 5:53 am, edited 2 times in total.

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