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PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2005 10:09 pm 
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Heey Mark maan<br>good of ya to touch base with us all here<br><br>your explainations are like concreting in pieces of a puzzle i've dwelt with for a wee while<br><br>if you would could you care to explain the whole studebacher hoch phenomenum to us, and th intricacies so-for there intwined .. (?)

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PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2005 10:23 pm 
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UK tickets on sale now via internet pre-sale at http://www.getlive.co.uk.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2005 3:59 am 
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http://www.bikel.com/guestbook.html<br>200 Motels didn't seem to be important enough to make it into his scrapbook (Freak!).  There doesn't seem to be any way to personally correspond to him on the sight, (I didn't spend too long looking though) but it does state he reads the guestbook!   I'll leave posting up to you, since I'm probably a lot less likely to get a response (just cause I never had a thing in the charts, with a BULLET!) I am B'wana dik, but that's another story.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2005 4:13 am 
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That arrest story is amazing!  Did you guys get any extra compensation for the jail time?   In terms of the shotgun holding redneck inciting the anti-smut loyalty oath, would you and Eddie have been expected to take the bullet?   <br>About the Joni Mitchell story, I have heard mention of this, me and my girlfriend especially, are huge Joni fans.  What is Penelope fucks the sea?  any recollections about this incident would be greatly appreciated, as are all your responses!   Thank you for your time, and for what you brought to Zappa's band every night you were a part of it!

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2005 4:21 am 
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Mom and Dad especially from Playground Psychotics I feel is much better than the original.  Also, Call Any Vegetable from those years is by far one of my favorite tracks in the Zappa cannon, from the song itself, to the amazing solos, to the improvised dialogue section, this song is always a massive treat.   It is possible my favorite moment in the history of humanity is Frank proclaiming on JABFLA "It's so fucking great to be alive" speech.  It sounded like you and Howard enjoyed that too!   One last question before I end my clogging of this thread, did you get tapes of different shows, recording sessions, rehearsals from Frank, or do you only have the official releases to reminiss?

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2005 5:18 am 
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Wait, one more thing.   I love your performance on Holiday in Berlin, in my opinion, that era had the best rendition of this song.   Unfortunately Frank never released a version with the full lyrics, why was that?  They are amazing the way the suit the melody, did he not want to piss off German people?

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2005 6:04 am 
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[quote author=Flo link=board=concerts;num=1115732614;start=165#168 date=05/31/05 at 18:53:37]<br>I remember a time in Virginia Beach when we were performing Billy The Mountain and we sang the part in the song where we sang over and over"A Mountain is something you don't want to F*$@ with, don't want to F*$@ with, don't f*$@ around."  I think we said the dreaded F-word at least 20 some odd times.  As we sang the song we noticed that the police were all getting together and moving towards the stage.  When the show ended they came backstage to deal with the problem. They were pissed off.  The decision was made by management to keep Frank out of jail and so it was decided to give them Flo & Eddie.  Management decided that we should go to jail because we were the ones actually singing the words.<br>We did sing the words and we did go to jail.<br>We were booked for disturbing the peace because they had no law on the books for obscenity.  We were in jail about 4 hours and at about 2 AM they let us go home, back to our dingy hotel.  Eventually it came up in court while we were in Europe and we were found guilty.  Imagine being found guilty without defending yourself..Oh well it did keep Frank's name out of court and out of the papers<br>They management paid a $3,000 fine for each of us and that was that.<br>The point was that Frank never had his name associated with the arrest and we had trouble coming back to play in Virginia Beach during our Pop Star Massage Unit Flo & Eddie days.  Nothing too dramatic happened, just a bit of pressure about what we would sing in our show.<br><br>[/quote]<br><br>Great story Mark. I have an awesome Dick Barber interview where he talks about it too. He laughs his ass off about it!!<br><br>

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2005 10:36 am 
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Noah: You have a great point! In my opnion, the unreleased version of "...Berlin" contains the most provocative lyrics ever written by FZ! Maybe they were just made out of frustration due to a single incident, maybe not. We don't know. But let us just recall the core line of the song as it sounded in 1970:<br><br>See the student leader (la-la-la-la-la-la)<br>He’s a Rebel Prophet (la-la-la-la-la-la)<br>He’s forgot he’s still a Nazi like his Mon and Dad.<br><br>That is still (35 years later) quite strong material.<br><br>What do - or Flo of the Forum - you all think? A political "blunder" of Frank's? Or,..., will we hear these lines in Europe this fall????

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2005 11:36 am 
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I thought the line was "he's fucked up he's still a Nazi"<br>Maybe I'm wrong.   I have wondered about the reasons for not releasing this for a long time.   Love that threw tomatoes line!

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2005 12:49 pm 
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I quote word-by-word from 1970, 11/14 Fillmore East. Obviously, the lyrics may have undergone variations through time.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2005 4:29 am 
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Great to be back <br>Sorry I forgot to answer this last time <br>The John and Yoko thing has always been treated as more than it really was.  That is my opinion.  Flo & Eddie even claim it in our bio that we sang with John Lennon on Sometime in New York City,” but really I feel that it was never really that much of anything.  I think that John was really trying to get out of the house and do things and coming to sing with Frank was a good thing for his mind and spirit at the time.  Frank and John had planned the entire “improvisational moment” and it actually took a few days of rehearsals to make it look that way.  Frank, Howard and I would travel up town to John and Yoko’s place to put the entire evening together.  I remember the rehearsals being very low-key and John and Frank putting most of the musical ideas together.  I was really star-struck about the whole thing, being a huge Lennon fan, and felt that our job was relegated to that of being background singers filling out the ideas that they were putting together.  John and Yoko were really sweet and treated us very kind when we were at their house.  The one thing I do remember was there was some sort of drug thing going on.  People buying from some guy who was instructed to keep it from the other party so they would not know.  The dealer guy told us that they were not telling each other what the other was doing, which was buying stuff from the same guy and having him keep it from the other person.  It was really weird shit, that whole scene going on while we were putting the music together.  The material was not really that strong and we even did a version on King Kong with them on board.  I loved the one original Lennon song we did “Oh Well” and I thought we did a good job of it.  John was a bit out of whack the night of the show at the Fillmore.  He appeared nervous about his appearance and he had to be secluded along with Yoko in there own dressing room.  I think I remember him really relaxing with it all once he was finally on stage with the band.  He smiled and had a good time.  Frank had a great time giving John the signals that we used to make futuristic noises on stage and John enjoyed the power of leading us through the quacks, doots, screams and other yelps and things the band did with John conducting.  Scumbag was really part 2 of a 2 part extravaganza.  Part 1 was the song called “AAAWK.”  Yoko and John were really in to the whole bagism thing at the time and I think we were all a bit surprised when Yoko brought out the bag and climbed in.  John tied it at the top after lowering the mic into the bag and for the next 3 minutes she squawked from the bag.  “Scumbag was a pretty good moment for us all with Howard taking the lead for the most part.  I know Howard must have been really happy when he was given writing credit on that song.  Here was my partner with credits that read, Words & Music: Ono, Lennon, Kaylan and FZ.  Shit that still looks good on the credits.   John would eventually take our voices and mix them nearly off the “Sometime In New York City” Album.  He even took our original cover and scratched it all up taking writing credit on Frank’s songs as well.  Frank was really upset at the time.  I like the way Frank stood up to John eventually suing him until they resolved some writing and publishing issues and would use the original mixes on the playground Psychotics record.  I remember when I was up at the house and Frank played me the original mixes he intended using.  Over pepperoni pizza and coffee Frank had this devilish look on his face renaming one song “ A Small Eternity With Yoko Ono,” I think he felt that John had dissed him by remixing the stuff for his record and the versions on Psychotics was Franks way of getting the material finally heard the way it was intended. <br>


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2005 4:34 am 
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#2 <br>I do not remember a version of our “Holiday In Berlin” being on a record.  I loved our version and I really loved that song.  What album did it appear on?  I would love to hear that.  I loved when Frank would recycle the older material to our show so we could get a chance to do some of the great songs. <br>Personally I was not a fan of our slowed down version of Mom and Dad he used on Psychotics.  I did love the version we did of Charleena on that record.  There were other versions of Mom and Dad we did, faster versions that I wished he would have used, but those choices were always up to Frank.  You could remark about it.  You could even say how much you really liked a certain way we did a song but Frank would always choose what he thought would work for him.  Sometimes I think he did that to assume his role as the leader.  That was never hard to forget.  Any choices we had about music used on the records we did was always chosen by Frank and that had to be accepted from the rest of us.  The final word was always his.  No Matter how close we became, how much fun we had, how much folklore was there between you, all creative decisions were made by Frank.  It made things easier for him.  Frank took responsibility for all of that.  When we joked about how” He made us do it” it was nearly always true and it indicated who the real boss was.   <br><br># 3 <br>Studebaker hawk was the super hero whose name fit the guitar riff that Frank had created for that section of the Mountain Opera.  The instrumental on Psychotics demonstrates the musical integrity of Warner Brothers Records who chose to edit the entire solo from the Warner Brothers version.  The Psychotics on Ryco plays the entire piece the way it was intended to be used.  That mountain thing could last anywhere from 30 to 40 minutes depending on the night and how Frank was feeling. <br><br># 4 <br>We did not get any extra money for being the fools arrested that night, just a great story.   <br>Eventually it was expunged from Virginia Beach history. <br>


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2005 4:39 am 
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# 5 <br>Penelope wants to F*$@ the Sea was introduced by Joni Mitchell as a poem she had written that she could never perform, live or otherwise.  Joni was basically a real funny person.  I had lived up the hill from her on Lookout Mountain and knew her from our singer-songwriter nights in Laurel Canyon.  Her image was huge and her fans relied on her to maintain her status as the "earth mother to the stars".  Frank always got a kick out of stars joining us and sinking down to our level.  Grace Slick came up on stage one night and humped everyone on stage, albeit with her clothes on, as a gesture of her freedom to be weird.  When Joni recited the poem, Frank directed the band through a series of noises and musical sounds that followed the poem to its climax.  Joni had this huge smile on her face when she finished as though she had really broke some rules and Frank really laughed.  I mean with a huge big ol’ grin he laughed out loud.  Frank was someone you loved to perform for.  I remember a night in 1965 or 66, I am not sure when Howard and I saw it, went to the Garrick theater and Frank had these sailors, in uniform come out of the audience and perform really crazy shit with Jim “Motorhead” Sherwood and Ray Collins, something to do with stuffed giraffes or llamas, I can’t remember.  Frank had this way of being like Bob Barker on the Price is Right.  He gave everyone the carte blanche to act crazy.  Everyone felt like they could not be any crazier then Frank was, so why not just get weird. <br><br># 6 <br>We have done two cities where we played some of the music we did with Frank.  In LA at the House of Blues in 1996 and BB Kings in NY about 2001. <br>We did a medley (Peace Corp - American Way – Concentration moon – What’s the uglyest part of your body – Discorporate – Call any vegetable – Eddie are you kidding? – Peaches in regalia – Magic fingers. <br>Some nights we do a version of Road ladies but <br>Howard and I feel a responsibility to the promoters who advertise us and pay us  to perform as The Turtles.  We feel that we have a different show to play for The Turtle fans and we wish that we could convince promoters that all of our history is a valuble part of the mix.  To promoters its about drawing Turtle fans; they are not interested in our history with Frank or the music we did with Flo & Eddie. Someday that may change but for the moment, alas it doesn’t. <br><br>It’s Great to be here with you <br>Flo <br>


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2005 4:55 am 
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[quote author=Flo link=board=concerts;num=1115732614;start=180#187 date=06/02/05 at 07:29:59] The John and Yoko thing has always been treated as more than it really was.  That is my opinion.  Flo & Eddie even claim it in our bio that we sang with John Lennon on Sometime in New York City,” but really I feel that it was never really that much of anything.<br>[/quote]<br><br>Thank you Mark!! I have been saying this for years myself!!!<br><br> :P<br><br>

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2005 4:59 am 
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Oh, I saw other questions after I wrote all that....<br><br>I may have some unreleased recordings in my basement....but my wife hasn't helped me clean it out, so I don't know.  But I think most of the stuff I have is what you've got to listen to.  Unfortunately, Frank kept a tight reign on all recordings<br><br>"I think the different bands and lineups add a richness to  the FZ listening expierience. When you've heard one, you HAVEN'T heard them all. Flo and Eddie's period with Frank was very productive and added alot to the overall mystique of Zappa's work."<br><br>I think JCGreasy made a great point there.  I truly believe that's what Frank had in mind all along.  <br><br>-Flo


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2005 5:07 am 
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[quote author=Flo link=board=concerts;num=1115732614;start=180#187 date=06/02/05 at 07:29:59] John would eventually take our voices and mix them nearly off the “Sometime In New York City” Album.  He even took our original cover and scratched it all up taking writing credit on Frank’s songs as well.  Frank was really upset at the time.  I like the way Frank stood up to John eventually suing him until they resolved some writing and publishing issues and would use the original mixes on the playground Psychotics record.  I remember when I was up at the house and Frank played me the original mixes he intended using.  Over pepperoni pizza and coffee Frank had this devilish look on his face renaming one song “ A Small Eternity With Yoko Ono,” I think he felt that John had dissed him by remixing the stuff for his record and the versions on Psychotics was Franks way of getting the material finally heard the way it was intended. <br>[/quote]<br><br>What a creep! I am glad FZ stuck it to him too. The FZ mixes are a killer!!<br><br>

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2005 5:58 am 
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Wow flo, you could really write a fascinating history of Rock and roll from your perspective, you have had dealings (and been a member of) some major players.   Do you ever tour Canada with Eddie and theTurtles?   If you ever make it to Toronto I'll be there!   Dissapointing to hear you aren't able to even play your Flo and Eddie material!!!<br>a snippet of holiday in Berlin is on 200 motels as Would you Like a Snack.   I have a copy of one of the Beat the Boots, (when Zappa bootlegged the bootleggers)   it is called Freaks and Motherfuckers.    It contains a full version of Holiday and Berlin, Thank God!!!! Also it features some brilliant Zappa solos, a great Call Any Vegetable, and a Little House I Used to Live in, far superior to Fillmore East in my opinion.   It has an ugly black and white drawing of Frank on the cover, I strongly suggest searching it out.   It contains some of my favorite recordings from that period.   <br>Another question....   Did you continue to listen to Frank's music through the years, and if so, any comments on specific albums/songs and the general path his career took.  THANKS!!!!

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2005 6:53 am 
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[quote author=Flo link=board=concerts;num=1115732614;start=180#187 date=06/02/05 at 07:29:59]Great to be back <br>Sorry I forgot to answer this last time <br>The John and Yoko thing has always been treated as more than it really was.  That is my opinion.  <br>[/quote]<br><br><br>Image

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2005 7:13 am 
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Fucking Lennon was a fucking idiot!!<br><br>Bagism?? Gimme a fucking break. Stupidest thing EVER!!!<br><br>http://homepage.ntlworld.com/carousel/pob07.html<br><br><br><br>Here's some "Bagism" for ya!!!<br><br>Image<br><br>

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2005 7:34 am 
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   Good one Jay P  !!!<br><br>   And don't be a stranger Mark !!!!!!!!


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2005 7:35 am 
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Hi Mark, some questions form Amsterdam Holland.<br><br>- Can you give some more history and info about the dutch song "GEEF MIJ WAT VLOERBEDEKKING ONDER DEZE VETTE ZWEVENDE SOFA". (also performed in german) (performed in Rotterdam Ahoy november 27 1971)<br><br>- Did you attend the famous PARADISO in Amsterdam with the Mothers? (you mention it in 1970 Mothers performances)<br><br>- Do you remember the famous VPRO Piknik concert in Uddel Holland for VPRO tv june 18 1970?<br><br> :D<br><br>VPRO PIKNIK Uddel Holland  1970<br>Image

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