Zappa.com

The Official Frank Zappa Messageboards
It is currently Wed Oct 22, 2014 7:30 am

All times are UTC - 8 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 33 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 7:38 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:17 pm
Posts: 2362
Location: Kapuskasing, Ontario
Just wondering if there is anyone else out there hoping for an 88 Vaulternative release. I absolutely love this band, and even though we have 5+ discs of all live 88, I feel like I could use more. I'm assuming they won't bother with a complete show until they can finally figure out a way to clear Texas Motel Suite as we all know that needs to see an official release. It is not only comedic gold but the arrangement of those songs are amazing. Personally I would love to hear a live Dragonmaster, and more of the King Kong / Big Swifty improvs which were so whacked on that tour, with the Synclavier and all. Just wishing out loud for anyone listening!

_________________
For my clinically insane music
http://routenote.com/album/FOWL
http://www.myspace.com/fowlmusic
http://www.last.fm/music/fowl
http://www.deezer.com/en/#music/fowl
Your mental health requires buying my cd


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 8:06 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:17 pm
Posts: 2362
Location: Kapuskasing, Ontario
Actually, I don't believe what is needed is a Vaulternative style full show, but a collation of all the songs they played which remain unreleased, with the best King Kong and Big Swifty still out there. The arrangements of classics on this tour were just so rich and beautiful, I don't feel any of them (with the exception of Packard Goose, the 88 version is perhaps my one sore spot in Frank's entire oevre.) deserve to be unreleased.

_________________
For my clinically insane music
http://routenote.com/album/FOWL
http://www.myspace.com/fowlmusic
http://www.last.fm/music/fowl
http://www.deezer.com/en/#music/fowl
Your mental health requires buying my cd


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 8:13 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2003 2:41 pm
Posts: 15000
FOWL wrote:
Actually, I don't believe what is needed is a Vaulternative style full show, but a collation of all the songs they played which remain unreleased, with the best King Kong and Big Swifty still out there. The arrangements of classics on this tour were just so rich and beautiful, I don't feel any of them (with the exception of Packard Goose, the 88 version is perhaps my one sore spot in Frank's entire oevre.) deserve to be unreleased.


We just want more of all eras. We're greedy, greedy people!

_________________
One of the sanest, surest, and most generous joys of life comes from being happy over the good fortune of others.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 8:24 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:17 pm
Posts: 2362
Location: Kapuskasing, Ontario
Agreed Cal! I just have a special place in my heart for 88, and I feel like one more double disc release could fully satisfy what I feel deserves to have been officially documented from that tour. The rest are all like 10 discs behind!

_________________
For my clinically insane music
http://routenote.com/album/FOWL
http://www.myspace.com/fowlmusic
http://www.last.fm/music/fowl
http://www.deezer.com/en/#music/fowl
Your mental health requires buying my cd


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 10:01 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Nov 22, 2008 8:22 pm
Posts: 2270
I vote yes!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 1:41 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 2:38 am
Posts: 1071
Location: Centerville, Norway
I would appreciate a good full show from 1988. After all that's the best Zappa band I ever heard in my life! But I think the sampler approach is pretty much exhausted with all the releases of that type from the rock/brass mothers of invective already, even large parts of a guitar album (which we don't have from 1978, for instance). I have the Barcelona DVD, and that set list from an actual show is a good variation from the brilliant compilations that Frank released in his time. You get a fine balance between new and old songs, because it's all there in one show. In my view, the ideal release from 1988 would be a double CD of an outstanding full show. But of course I wouldn't mind if they added a bonus disc of other unreleased highlights picked from the whole tour!

_________________
We make a special art in an environment hostile to dreamers. Frank Zappa, 1971


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 1:43 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:17 pm
Posts: 2362
Location: Kapuskasing, Ontario
Here are my thoughts. For starters, for the most part, I find the secret word thing a bit tiring, to hear the same word over and over again for a full two discs. I think for Best Band, the way he went with the Ring of Fire Show and just included highlights of that secret word mixed in with highlights from other show makes a perfect conceptual flow. It doesn't get tiring, but you get the idea. Same thing to a lesser extent with Confinement Loaf in Broadway. (side note, a burning question that's been going on in my head for a long time... In Any Kind of Pain, was there ever a "proper" lyric for the "When she's in a bold move ______ sounds good" or was it always just a blank left for the mystery word?)
Beyond that, I can't imagine a full show from 88 that fills in enough of the songs left unreleased, and there are enough to make a good release with some smoking improv sections to pad it. To me that's my ideal anyways, but ya, I'd be happy to buy a full show from 88. To my mind, we are not done with releases from this band. Actually my preference would be to complete the unreleased arrangements in a two disc set in the near future, then later on down the line pick out a stellar full vaulternative. Just my preference though. I'll challenge you to a duel if you disagree.

_________________
For my clinically insane music
http://routenote.com/album/FOWL
http://www.myspace.com/fowlmusic
http://www.last.fm/music/fowl
http://www.deezer.com/en/#music/fowl
Your mental health requires buying my cd


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2010 9:57 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2002 3:42 pm
Posts: 1035
Location: The Short Forest
I'd vote for this show. There are probably better ones, but significant because it's the last ever US show. You'd get the Beatles covers, Stairway is not reggae'd out, and Dweezil sits in for the encores.


3-25-88
Nassau Coliseum, Uniondale, NY
I : Black Page #2, I Ain't Got No Heart, Love Of My Life, Inca Roads, Sharleena, Who Needs The Peace Corps, Dickie's Such An Asshole, When The Lie's So Big, Jesus Thinks You're A Jerk*, Sofa
II : Packard Goose, Torture/Burt/Torture, City Of Tiny Lites, Pound For A Brown (w/Reverend A. West), Texas Motel Medley, Peaches En Regalia
E1 : Stairway To Heaven, I Am The Walrus, Whipping Post
E2 : Bolero, America The Beautiful


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2010 12:28 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 5:55 am
Posts: 1233
FOWL wrote:
(side note, a burning question that's been going on in my head for a long time... In Any Kind of Pain, was there ever a "proper" lyric for the "When she's in a bold move ______ sounds good" or was it always just a blank left for the mystery word?)


It was originally "'nu-cu-lar' sounds good" but that only lasted a few shows.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2010 2:59 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:17 pm
Posts: 2362
Location: Kapuskasing, Ontario
pbuzby wrote:
FOWL wrote:
(side note, a burning question that's been going on in my head for a long time... In Any Kind of Pain, was there ever a "proper" lyric for the "When she's in a bold move ______ sounds good" or was it always just a blank left for the mystery word?)


It was originally "'nu-cu-lar' sounds good" but that only lasted a few shows.

Thank you! I'd always wondered about that!
And ya, not having heard it, but from the looks of the setlist, that collates a lot of stuff that should be documented from that tour that hasn't been yet. I was listening to a show from Stockholm with Dweezil that had a Whipping Post that just destroyed every other version I've heard. So I'd assume this one with Dweezil is in a similar category. And you know what? Interesting there was no Pound for a Brown on Make a Jazz Noise here!

_________________
For my clinically insane music
http://routenote.com/album/FOWL
http://www.myspace.com/fowlmusic
http://www.last.fm/music/fowl
http://www.deezer.com/en/#music/fowl
Your mental health requires buying my cd


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 10:09 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Aug 23, 2002 10:21 am
Posts: 165
Location: Rome
I'd like to have some Moggio, What's new in Baltimore, Easy meat or Marqueson's Kitchen released...

_________________
Listen to my cover of We Are Not Alone here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECL85C7SH6g


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 11:30 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:17 pm
Posts: 2362
Location: Kapuskasing, Ontario
Sterbus wrote:
I'd like to have some Moggio, What's new in Baltimore, Easy meat or Marqueson's Kitchen released...


That's what I'm sayin' Sterbus! We NEED an 88 comp!

_________________
For my clinically insane music
http://routenote.com/album/FOWL
http://www.myspace.com/fowlmusic
http://www.last.fm/music/fowl
http://www.deezer.com/en/#music/fowl
Your mental health requires buying my cd


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 11:40 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 5:55 am
Posts: 1233
They didn't play Moggio during the tour.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 1:24 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2003 2:41 pm
Posts: 15000
pbuzby wrote:
They didn't play Moggio during the tour.


Never release anything from this band again.

_________________
One of the sanest, surest, and most generous joys of life comes from being happy over the good fortune of others.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 3:07 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:17 pm
Posts: 2362
Location: Kapuskasing, Ontario
calvin2hikers wrote:
pbuzby wrote:
They didn't play Moggio during the tour.


Never release anything from this band again.



My retort is never release anything from your forum account again!

_________________
For my clinically insane music
http://routenote.com/album/FOWL
http://www.myspace.com/fowlmusic
http://www.last.fm/music/fowl
http://www.deezer.com/en/#music/fowl
Your mental health requires buying my cd


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 4:19 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2003 2:41 pm
Posts: 15000
FOWL wrote:
calvin2hikers wrote:
pbuzby wrote:
They didn't play Moggio during the tour.


Never release anything from this band again.



My retort is never release anything from your forum account again!


There's no Moggio. Case closed, /thread.

_________________
One of the sanest, surest, and most generous joys of life comes from being happy over the good fortune of others.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 7:49 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:17 pm
Posts: 2362
Location: Kapuskasing, Ontario
calvin2hikers wrote:

There's no Moggio. Case closed, /thread.


Good! I was hoping you'd comment! Now by some reciprocal logic, I can assume they will release some more 88!

_________________
For my clinically insane music
http://routenote.com/album/FOWL
http://www.myspace.com/fowlmusic
http://www.last.fm/music/fowl
http://www.deezer.com/en/#music/fowl
Your mental health requires buying my cd


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 9:01 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Aug 23, 2002 10:21 am
Posts: 165
Location: Rome
pbuzby wrote:
They didn't play Moggio during the tour.


Pardonnez-moi! :D
I'm probably mis-remembering the 1987 rehearsals tapes... I checked it out, RDNZL was on it...

_________________
Listen to my cover of We Are Not Alone here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECL85C7SH6g


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 10:19 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 8:06 pm
Posts: 1992
Location: Canada
88's tapes are not in danger like the oldest one, if i was ZFT i would release the old stuff while they can.

_________________
'N then I might just Jump back on An' ride Like a cowboy Into the dawn to Montana


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 11:38 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 5:55 am
Posts: 1233
Sterbus wrote:
pbuzby wrote:
They didn't play Moggio during the tour.


Pardonnez-moi! :D
I'm probably mis-remembering the 1987 rehearsals tapes... I checked it out, RDNZL was on it...


RDNZL is just Ed, Scott and Chad, seguing out of Dancin' Fool as they did in 1982. Sounds like a bit of a joke. Interesting that afterwards Scott says "I do not want to remember that song."

Keneally's site mentions that FZ axed Moggio after he called for it in rehearsal and the band didn't sound good on it.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 30, 2010 1:10 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2003 2:41 pm
Posts: 15000
FOWL wrote:
calvin2hikers wrote:

There's no Moggio. Case closed, /thread.


Good! I was hoping you'd comment! Now by some reciprocal logic, I can assume they will release some more 88!


They never will. Ever.

So something will be out in a month according to my track record.

(I would actually like to see something a little earlier. Wasn't there a Garrick recording in the vault?)

_________________
One of the sanest, surest, and most generous joys of life comes from being happy over the good fortune of others.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 2:40 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:17 pm
Posts: 2362
Location: Kapuskasing, Ontario
Zut_boF wrote:
88's tapes are not in danger like the oldest one, if i was ZFT i would release the old stuff while they can.



Valid point Zut, I can wholeheartedly support that decision. If there were a Garrick show documented, I would strongly suggest it's release for historical purposes. But more original mothers should be released, judging from the boots, there were non-stop weirdness and one of a kind events, as well as some great improv. There really should be more.

_________________
For my clinically insane music
http://routenote.com/album/FOWL
http://www.myspace.com/fowlmusic
http://www.last.fm/music/fowl
http://www.deezer.com/en/#music/fowl
Your mental health requires buying my cd


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 8:09 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 8:06 pm
Posts: 1992
Location: Canada
FOWL wrote:
If there were a Garrick show documented, I would strongly suggest it's release for historical purposes.


I see Zappa material as a secret weapon oldest stuff are the proof that Frank was a head of his time. Maybe ZFT are waiting a bit for all the (big artists) make there historical statements and to later on make em looking ridicule by showing to the world some crazy stuff the Mothers was doing before all the idiots plastic robots :mrgreen:

_________________
'N then I might just Jump back on An' ride Like a cowboy Into the dawn to Montana


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 8:36 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:17 pm
Posts: 2362
Location: Kapuskasing, Ontario
Zut_boF wrote:
FOWL wrote:
If there were a Garrick show documented, I would strongly suggest it's release for historical purposes.


I see Zappa material as a secret weapon oldest stuff are the proof that Frank was a head of his time. Maybe ZFT are waiting a bit for all the (big artists) make there historical statements and to later on make em looking ridicule by showing to the world some crazy stuff the Mothers was doing before all the idiots plastic robots :mrgreen:


Well personally I believe "How Did That Get In There?" Off of Lumpy Money goes a long way to proving this. He was way ahead of the jazz fusion pioneers, imagine if that thing had been released in that form when it was recorded? I think it would have put a whole new historical spin on his legacy. That to me is one of the most amazing things released posthumously.

_________________
For my clinically insane music
http://routenote.com/album/FOWL
http://www.myspace.com/fowlmusic
http://www.last.fm/music/fowl
http://www.deezer.com/en/#music/fowl
Your mental health requires buying my cd


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 88 Vaulternative?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 11:03 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Apr 05, 2006 11:11 pm
Posts: 3606
Location: Vancouver, BC
FOWL wrote:
Zut_boF wrote:
FOWL wrote:
If there were a Garrick show documented, I would strongly suggest it's release for historical purposes.


I see Zappa material as a secret weapon oldest stuff are the proof that Frank was a head of his time. Maybe ZFT are waiting a bit for all the (big artists) make there historical statements and to later on make em looking ridicule by showing to the world some crazy stuff the Mothers was doing before all the idiots plastic robots :mrgreen:


Well personally I believe "How Did That Get In There?" Off of Lumpy Money goes a long way to proving this. He was way ahead of the jazz fusion pioneers, imagine if that thing had been released in that form when it was recorded? I think it would have put a whole new historical spin on his legacy. That to me is one of the most amazing things released posthumously.


100% agreed. Phenomenal track...

_________________
:53 - :57...

"...I'm absolutely a Libertarian on MANY issues..." ~ Frank Zappa, Rochester, NY, March 11, 1988


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 33 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group