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PostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 3:36 am 
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http://www.jamesdarrah.com/frank-zappa-200-MOTELS

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 3:53 am 
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Thank you for that link, very informative.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 8:40 am 
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The Forum Killed Arkay wrote:
Thank you for that link, very informative.

You're welcome......

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 30, 2013 4:19 am 
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brainpang wrote:
There's so much bullshit going on around here that this seems to have been missed. Thankyou Mr Pang. The subtitle says "Quirky, avant-garde rocker's work to mark Disney Hall's 10th anniversary". What?! And then later on "With the work’s fragmented past firmly in mind, the L.A. Phil — in honor of the Walt Disney Concert Hall’s 10th anniversary — has decided to perform “200 Motels” in its entirety for the first time on Oct. 23" WHAT??!! How about in honour of the 20th anniversary of Zappa's passing.

Contrast this to talk from the presenters of the performance in the SouthBank Centre in London. "One of the music events of the year Frank Zappa's legendary 1971 work 200 Motels is performed live in concert for the first ever time in the UK." See, not associated with anything except the man himself.

And they're pulling out all the stops: "This colossal piece, one of the most ambitious that Zappa ever wrote, is performed by the full forces of the BBC Concert Orchestra, Southbank Sinfonia, London Voices and a large cast of rock musicians, singers and actors."

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 30, 2013 10:34 am 
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I wish I could go to both shows. I wonder if anyone is.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:15 pm 
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polydigm wrote:
brainpang wrote:
There's so much bullshit going on around here that this seems to have been missed. Thankyou Mr Pang. The subtitle says "Quirky, avant-garde rocker's work to mark Disney Hall's 10th anniversary". What?! And then later on "With the work’s fragmented past firmly in mind, the L.A. Phil — in honor of the Walt Disney Concert Hall’s 10th anniversary — has decided to perform “200 Motels” in its entirety for the first time on Oct. 23" WHAT??!! How about in honour of the 20th anniversary of Zappa's passing.

Contrast this to talk from the presenters of the performance in the SouthBank Centre in London. "One of the music events of the year Frank Zappa's legendary 1971 work 200 Motels is performed live in concert for the first ever time in the UK." See, not associated with anything except the man himself.

And they're pulling out all the stops: "This colossal piece, one of the most ambitious that Zappa ever wrote, is performed by the full forces of the BBC Concert Orchestra, Southbank Sinfonia, London Voices and a large cast of rock musicians, singers and actors."

Well, you know Disney. They'll stick a parrot in it, somewhere, and claim copyright on the music.
Looking forward to Gail and Disney fighting that one out.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 30, 2013 3:26 pm 
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Got a good chuckle out of that, jpd. Thank you.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 10:11 am 
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This is from a link in the current online edition of Gramophone:

>>In May 1970 at UCLA’s Pauley Pavilion, Zubin Mehta led the Los Angeles Philharmonic and Frank Zappa & The Mothers of Invention in the world premiere of Zappa’s Concerto for Mothers and Orchestra. Zappa incorporated some of that music into the score for his surrealistic band-on-the-road film 200 Motels, released the following year, as was a soundtrack double album featuring the Royal Philharmonic Orchestra and narrator Theodore Bikel, as well as the Mothers. Zappa was often frustrated with orchestras, but his music was gradually embraced by the classical world, particularly as championed by Pierre Boulez. (Boulez also conducted the LA Phil in a concert that was also part of the same Contempo ’70 mini-festival that featured Zappa’s Concerto.)
Come for:

A once-in-a-lifetime concert event celebrating the spirit of creative freedom that Walt Disney Concert Hall epitomizes.<<

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 4:17 am 
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The Forum Killed Arkay wrote:
Wow Trendy! A full-on prediction! Who would have guessed, but there you have it! I didn't think you'd actually do it!
So, now that you have predicted that there will NOT be a rock band performing with the Orchestra, I guess its good that you actually posted on this thread. We sure had to wade through a ton of shit to get there though.
Lets see...
Drummer - Check!
Bass Player - Check!
Keyboardist - Check!
Maybe its just a wild prediction of my own, but I'm guessing there will be a guitar player.


No full on prediction on my part. Drums, Bass & Keyboards? Wildcard Guitar Player ?

As far as Rock Instrumentation, maybe more, maybe less, maybe you're spot on. However it all is adapted, I expect that the orchestra will be doing more than what we saw in the record and the film. I think they will have an amazing opportunity to dig deep into the composers landscape. I was more-so bringing what Gail and the columnist spoke of in the Billboard article to the forefront. That being that the adaptation of FZs original score emphasises the orchestral elements.

History has shown that many fans get carried away with Marque names. Especially when Mothers Of Invention alumni are involved. Not to downplay any really fine musician that has any role in this program, but I don't think the names or what specific rock band instrumentation,.... how many rock instruments will be there, that rock band role won't overtly be defining of the overall production. If we take a look at the instrumentation of the mothers of invention at the particular time the film and movie were made, the liner notes state, The MOTHERS on this particular occasion. The rock band side of things always seemed flexible.

While I don't have access to FZs original score it seems the instrumentation for the so called Rock Instrumentation is flexible. We should see the orchestra doing a bit more than we had in the film and album.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 5:36 am 
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C'mon Trendy, stop changing your mind. Now you are saying that it could be anything, well that's where we started.
(Thanks, sleepy)

In the meantime, if anyone has any info on these questions, I'd appreciate it:

The Forum Killed Arkay wrote:
Help please. Now that I have my ticket, I've got questions about the performance. I'm trying to find some linx that describe the differences between the performance and the movie. Also, I'm curious about the differences between the LA and London performances besides being different orchestras with different conductors. Lastly, who is performing? I'm fairly sure that there is a rock band involved and that Thunes is playing in London. But, who else? I've been looking around on this here internet, which is supposed to have all the information in the world, and can't find a damn thing. Is all this supposed to be a secret?

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 5:41 am 
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polydigm wrote:
brainpang wrote:
There's so much bullshit going on around here that this seems to have been missed. Thankyou Mr Pang. The subtitle says "Quirky, avant-garde rocker's work to mark Disney Hall's 10th anniversary". What?! And then later on "With the work’s fragmented past firmly in mind, the L.A. Phil — in honor of the Walt Disney Concert Hall’s 10th anniversary — has decided to perform “200 Motels” in its entirety for the first time on Oct. 23" WHAT??!! How about in honour of the 20th anniversary of Zappa's passing.

Contrast this to talk from the presenters of the performance in the SouthBank Centre in London. "One of the music events of the year Frank Zappa's legendary 1971 work 200 Motels is performed live in concert for the first ever time in the UK." See, not associated with anything except the man himself.

And they're pulling out all the stops: "This colossal piece, one of the most ambitious that Zappa ever wrote, is performed by the full forces of the BBC Concert Orchestra, Southbank Sinfonia, London Voices and a large cast of rock musicians, singers and actors."

Yeah, its hilarious how Disney sees Disney as the important part of the performance, ugh. Fragmented past? Not the best way to talk up the show.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 6:24 am 
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The Forum Killed Arkay wrote:
polydigm wrote:
brainpang wrote:
There's so much bullshit going on around here that this seems to have been missed. Thankyou Mr Pang. The subtitle says "Quirky, avant-garde rocker's work to mark Disney Hall's 10th anniversary". What?! And then later on "With the work’s fragmented past firmly in mind, the L.A. Phil — in honor of the Walt Disney Concert Hall’s 10th anniversary — has decided to perform “200 Motels” in its entirety for the first time on Oct. 23" WHAT??!! How about in honour of the 20th anniversary of Zappa's passing.

Contrast this to talk from the presenters of the performance in the SouthBank Centre in London. "One of the music events of the year Frank Zappa's legendary 1971 work 200 Motels is performed live in concert for the first ever time in the UK." See, not associated with anything except the man himself.

And they're pulling out all the stops: "This colossal piece, one of the most ambitious that Zappa ever wrote, is performed by the full forces of the BBC Concert Orchestra, Southbank Sinfonia, London Voices and a large cast of rock musicians, singers and actors."

Yeah, its hilarious how Disney sees Disney as the important part of the performance, ugh. Fragmented past? Not the best way to talk up the show.


Have ya seen the Disney theater? It IS the star AND, I bet, chief draw for events.
Be comforted knowing there are loads of LA snobs who are infuriated that FZ is (one of) the artists celebrating the 10th.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 7:30 am 
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Yeah, after I had that little rant, I decided it was better to interpret it as an honour that FZ was chosen. I'm still more impressed with the unbridled way in which the Brits are taking it on.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 3:42 am 
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The Forum Killed Arkay wrote:
C'mon Trendy, stop changing your mind. Now you are saying that it could be anything, well that's where we started.
(Thanks, sleepy)



I'm not changing my mind, but history has shown us that Anything Anytime Anywhere For No Reason At All can play a role.... Expect The Unexpected... We can expect anything and a surprise can come. If you want to remain "fairly sure that there is a rock band involved" there is no need to continue to argue. I don't want make it seem like one. I more-so just want to point out the history and what Gail and editorials are talking about. From my view I just don't want to over-speculate on the rock side of things.

But in speaking of the recent live history of 200 Motels: The 13 Suites adaptation that took place in the Netherlands back in 2000. As far as the instrumentation there was not a single composition that focused on a large scaled rock band. As far as what one may perceive as traditional rock instrumentation there was one drummer and one keyboard player. The Billboard article only further reiterated that the Full Score adaptation will emphasize orchestral elements. While I have not heard any recordings of the suites the instrumentation would not lead one to expect those heavy rock guitar chords in Shove It Right In. Now maybe some of those AUD tape traders are well rehearsed on the arrangements from 200 Motels: The 13 Suites from 2000 but in reading up on that event, the Billboard article and FZs trend with orchestras I want to be very careful not to overemphasize the role of the rock ensemble that plays along with the orchestra and choral group. You are one of the lucky ones to attend the LA event.

Back in 2003 I attended Zappa and the Emerging American Composer a Carnegie Hall. That event had Ali Askin's adaptation of The Adventures of Greggery Peccary and a number of Zappa's works. In that particular composition we could here that the adaptation focused on the orchestra and soloists emphasizing all the parts. The trend of adaptations of the composers work to emphasize the orchestral elements,,, as time went on that FZ worked with Orchestra's and Ensembles he was doing that, geting the most he could out of that instrumentation, the trend continues of how we can hear the orchestra,, that is something very special. Not that there is anything wrong with mixing in a rock band with an orchestra and chorale group but I think it is pertinent to give respect to adaptations to the score to emphasize the orchestral elements.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 4:26 am 
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polydigm wrote:
brainpang wrote:
There's so much bullshit going on around here that this seems to have been missed. Thankyou Mr Pang. The subtitle says "Quirky, avant-garde rocker's work to mark Disney Hall's 10th anniversary". What?! And then later on "With the work’s fragmented past firmly in mind, the L.A. Phil — in honor of the Walt Disney Concert Hall’s 10th anniversary — has decided to perform “200 Motels” in its entirety for the first time on Oct. 23" WHAT??!! How about in honour of the 20th anniversary of Zappa's passing.

Contrast this to talk from the presenters of the performance in the SouthBank Centre in London. "One of the music events of the year Frank Zappa's legendary 1971 work 200 Motels is performed live in concert for the first ever time in the UK." See, not associated with anything except the man himself.

And they're pulling out all the stops: "This colossal piece, one of the most ambitious that Zappa ever wrote, is performed by the full forces of the BBC Concert Orchestra, Southbank Sinfonia, London Voices and a large cast of rock musicians, singers and actors."


I don't feel the need to bundle the Variety clipping into any perceptions of bullshit. While they could have chosen a different keyword to describe Frank Zappa An American Composer the so called keyword of Quirky is a peculiar peculiarity of a modern generation that needs to fit in as much punch into a single editorial blog heading keyword-word. I just don't think that the average columnist and reader can associate with an acronym as AAAFNRAA. One thing for sure about the composers so called quirkiness. In speaking of one of the defining factors of quirkiness there certainly are many sharp turns and twists in the composers work. I'll look past the blog head writing trends and get into the meat and potatoes of what is being served at the theatre.

In regards to FZs orchestral score for 200 Motels, "with the work’s fragmented past firmly in mind, (←the comma would indicate a well deserved pause).....the L.A. Phil — in honor of the Walt Disney Concert Hall’s 10th anniversary — has decided to perform “200 Motels” in its entirety for the first time".... Is this not exactly what the history of evolution of the score has had. Clearly the composers score never had the opportunity to be performed in it's entirety. Not in the film, not on record and not in the theatre. Is this not the world premier....???? Yes the fragmented past will always be what it will be. It is clear that the Variety editorial gives not only information about the fragmented past but that this will be a world premier of the full orchestral score. Yes there are some new elements in the adaptation, seemingly from the Variety and prior Billboard articles, that emphasize the orchestral elements, but there is no doubt that this is the world premier of the full orchestral score.

......

"Though the L.A. Phil’s production will employ some newly devised elements, the primary concern of Zappa’s widow, Gail, is in presenting a version that is faithful to Frank’s original musical vision. “I’m extremely hands on,” says Gail Zappa, executor of the Zappa estate. “My job is to protect the intent of the composer and serve the integrity of the music.”

With the careful transcription and assembly efforts of Zappa Family Trust scoremeister Kurt Morgan, Zappa helped deliver the comprehensive score that will be used for the upcoming performance."

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FZ "Read It And Weep"
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Frank Zappa left the ZFT in Control of his Vaults and Artistic rights.
We the fans are not in control. We have a choice to use our eyes and ears or read it and weep.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 3:13 pm 
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OK, Trendy, it seems like you really want to say something about this, so I'll try to take you at face value. You have expounded a great deal on the premise that this will be something of an Orchestral Arrangement. This may well be true. I wish you had maintained your prediction that there will be no rock band, on the basis that you may have been right! But, now it doesn't matter because you won't be right no matter what, because you aren't making any predictions beyond it being an Orchestral Arrangement, which no matter what, it will be. You abuse AAFRNAA a bit by using the word "Anything" to mean "Anything that the ZFT comes up with" rather than "Anything at All". In fact, I would hazard a guess that "Anything at All" is anathema to you when it doesn't reference the ZFT.
But, back to your Orchestral Arrangement thought. You do know that this is how Muzak is made, right? Its been done for every band you hear in elevators. There are albums full of Muzak made by transferring melodies from electric guitar to bassoon or vocals to harp. This can be a great technique or can totally suck. In this case, I am under the impression that FZ wrote some notes that can inform these performances. I want to know what FZ planned for this type of event, and how those instructions are being interpreted by the ZFT. I appreciate that the ZFT is taking this on, but I want to be able to follow the trail from FZ's instructions to the stage on Oct 23, the same way that can be done at any music library for any major composer. I believe that this performance is more connected to the composer than Dark Side of the Moon as performed by various orchestras, which utilizes your orchestral arrangement techniques. You seem very unconcerned with what FZ's contribution is here.
Imo, part of the CC is that FZ made 200 Motels as a Rock Band Meets Orchestra production. They may still leave the ROCK out of it, but I am guessing that it will be present, at least at times. I could be wrong, but that is what predictions are about. I would rather learn about the concepts, plans, elements involved and understand why choices are made than give the ZFT carte blanche as you constantly do. In fact, you give the ZFT so much rope that it is tantamount to not giving a shit what they do. GZ could sell you jimmie d's proverbial fart mixed to stereo and you'd call it Official.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 4:23 pm 
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The Forum Killed Arkay wrote:
GZ could sell you jimmie d's proverbial fart mixed to stereo and you'd call it Official.

+1
Slap that on a T-shirt with Trendy's face! :mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 12:36 am 
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This is the main problem with the Three-things-that-smell-like-monger, he doesn't even understand what he's commenting on. He's quoted my post above and completely misunderstood what the bullshit comment was referring to and then blathered on about all sorts without even mentioning what I was actually commenting on and that was the association with Walt Disney. And the other vomit he's produced on this page .... ???

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 8:26 am 
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Clean up on all aisles!


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 5:24 am 
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Trendmonger wrote:
Does he need [to know] every person in the LA Philharmonic or the Chorale group?


Well if TFKA does, according to this, it's just the women of the LA Master Chorale...and Lou Anne Neill will be performing in her capacity as the LA Phil's Principal harpist.

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www.FestivalMoo-AH.com


Last edited by The Idiot Bastard on Fri Sep 13, 2013 1:45 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 6:09 am 
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I am married, so no. But, its always nice to put a name to a face to a harp. Thanx IB.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:25 am 
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A few tickets just became available. get 'em while their hot!

http://www.ticketmaster.com/10th-annive ... 08BAE58EFE


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 2:50 pm 
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Mailer arrived today from the LA Phil...

Image

Image

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2013 4:54 pm 
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Still not a sell out.

https://oss.ticketmaster.com/html/outsi ... 3DEPH1023E


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2013 5:16 am 
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It sure will be. Only 2 left. That's awesome.


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