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 Post subject: FZ on his own work
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2002 4:02 am 
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In a TV ducumentary from the two austrians Rudi and Frank (DoRo) FZ says something I don`t agree with:<br><br>"I don`t think the work that I´ve done in the last 25 years has changed anything or anybody!"<br><br>It even makes me sad to hear, bacause I am the living proof of the opposite!<br>How about you guys?  <br><br>PS: I know, it`s Franks typical sarcasm, he maybe wasn`t too serious on this, and he won`t let things get too pathetic and so...don`t tell me... wanna hear your oppinion or similar quotes.

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 Post subject: Re: FZ on his own work
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2002 12:22 pm 
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FZ also said that his entire career was one big failure. The thing is that he had extremely grandiose concepts; apparently none of what was actually realized measured up to the business in his head. This may be hard for some to appreciate; unfortunately (for me) I understand EXACTLY  what he meant.


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 Post subject: Re: FZ on his own work
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2002 12:52 am 
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Dear ZF, dear civil!<br><br>True, it would not ahve been Frank if he said: I changed many things, I had influence on so many people!<br>It`s typical Frank. (Like the quote that all people are assholes.)  <br>All that`s true. Fair enough. But that was not the thing I wanted to point out. "Change" in my understanding would not mean "change the world" in a naive 60`s sence. I`m not into that, I´m not pathetic. But: am I the only one who can say that Frank`s music has changed his views on music, society, my personal taste, my humor? Has it not influenced (=changed) attitudes of various musicians and many fans? See Matt Groening: he claims FZ his big influence. His cartoons would have been the same without Frank? I think no. Or see a guy like Mike Keneally or Steve Vai, Vaclav Havel.... Frank made many People think. He did not change the world or politics or society. But, as you said: he was an artist and entertainer, and these people DO make diffferences. That`s my philosophy on art and music...<br>Myself, I would see things different if I had not stuck to FZ for the last 22 years! Sure it was the right thing at the right time for me, maybe, (that`s deeper psychology about what comes first: your choice or your influence on a choice). <br>  

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 Post subject: Re: FZ on his own work
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2002 3:03 am 
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[quote author=zliq link=board=quotes&num=1034089352&start=0#4 date=10/10/02 at 03:52:19]<br> But: am I the only one who can say that Frank`s music has changed his views on music, society, my personal taste, my humor? [/quote] <br><br>No, I agree with you, zliq. I've said this before on the board, but listening to FZ at age 15 has really influenced my tastes in music. And I bet I'm definitely not the only one: some people here mentioned Varese as one of their favorite composers. Now: how many people here would have checked out his work if it weren't for Frank championing his music all over the years? <br><br>And the same goes for Eric Dolphy or even Stravinsky. Sure, these people were already well-known by lovers of jazz or modern classical music, but I bet that some people checked out their work because Frank appreciated their music. <br><br>I guess FZ really made some self-deprecating remarks over the years. In the liner notes to 'Ahead of their Time' and 'YCDTOSA vol 2', he describes these concerts as 'fair' or 'average', but to me, those are some of the best live albums ever released.

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 Post subject: Re: FZ on his own work
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2002 11:10 am 
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FZ is one of my major inspirations and a testiment to the belief that no matter how others perceive your art/your views/ yourself, it doesn't matter as long as your comfortable about it. <br>And that if you really put the effort into something, despite how esoteric and unwelcomed, if you really believe in it and work really hard, you can break that lock and get to the Suzy Creamcheese of desired results. <br><br>*wow* did FZ teach me all that?<br> :o


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 Post subject: Re: FZ on his own work
PostPosted: Wed Dec 25, 2002 12:36 pm 
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When I was stuck in a god forsaken country with no money no friends and no way out, all I had was my Zappa tapes and albums. The guitar work helped me through. Discovering the subltety of his play, the way he moved from idea to idea in seconds... each time I played a piece it sounded new like you felt he was trying to express something of that elusive self that he loved to keep hidden behind all the bullshit....whatever came out of the mouth was nothing to what came off the strings...


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 Post subject: re: fz on his own work
PostPosted: Sat May 24, 2003 9:40 am 
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[size=92]the observer interview w/c.s.murray,[/size] fz wrote:
with valley girl my daughter did an interview & brought along an acetate of the song, they played it on  the air & the phones went crazy, the station held on to the acetate and kept playing it, & the thing was such an instant grassroots hit that other stations were taping it off the air & playing it; it didn't sell a lot, maybe 350,000 copies & the album s.a.t.l.t.s.a.d/witch maybe did 125,000 units; but sociologically, it was the most important record in 1982 in the u.s.

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 Post subject: Re: FZ on his own work
PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2003 8:03 am 
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well i dont think he's effected me too much, but i agree with alot of what he says and he's brought me endless joy, i think he's amazing and in the department of "how did he effect me" i would say probably in the fact that he gave me a bit of hope for america, and he's been a huge inspiration and he's given me some brain food and continues to do so, if i need some inspiration, the first guy i go to is zappa.

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 Post subject: re: fz on his own work
PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2005 6:55 pm 
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prior to the release of ycdtosa series, b.springsteen released a 5-album retrospective...

[size=84]keyboard mag interview [/size] fz wrote:
well, i don't think there will be any comparison between his live set & this thing; this is going to be a real musicians album...

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 Post subject: Re: FZ on his own work
PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 8:16 am 
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[quote author=zliq link=board=quotes;num=1034089352;start=0#0 date=10/08/02 at 07:02:32]In a TV ducumentary from the two austrians Rudi and Frank (DoRo) FZ says something I don`t agree with:<br><br>"I don`t think the work that I´ve done in the last 25 years has changed anything or anybody!"<br><br>It even makes me sad to hear, bacause I am the living proof of the opposite!<br>How about you guys?  <br><br>PS: I know, it`s Franks typical sarcasm, he maybe wasn`t too serious on this, and he won`t let things get too pathetic and so...don`t tell me... wanna hear your oppinion or similar quotes.[/quote]<br><br>I think although FZ was proud of what he managed in his career he felt he could have done better.<br><br>The amount of people FZ influenced is incredible. The people he influenced weren't just musicians.<br><br>I believe(although I don't know for sure) that the guys who make South Park are huge FZ fans.<br><br>FZ also proved that if you are smart enough you can make just amount whatever music you like and still make ALOT of money...<br><br> ;D<br>

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 Post subject: re: fz on his own work
PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2005 9:40 pm 
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 3:36 pm 
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I think that maybe FZ was looking at the big picture. Although self critical, remember, this was the guy who encouraged the late 60's early 70's audience to ' register to vote '.

Musicians in the late 1960's had the attention of governmental officials because they were able to reach great masses of people. Certainly FZ knew this. I recall something to the effect that, Zappa, being not only very talented but also politically aware, was expected by his 1960's/early 1970's audience to generate political change ... I personally believe that he realised he was never going to influence politics in a major way through his music and earning a living to support his family was his more immediate concern. Hence the financially successful, non political Overnite Sensation and Apostrophe albums from the early 1970's.

Once self supportive, you all know about his re-emergence into politics in the 1980's. He overtly tackled governmental issues through music on the Broadway the Hardway album. I also recall reading somewhere that the 'powers' were very concerned about his openly critical opinion during this period and followed him closely. He died not long after that.

Strangely (to me), Bill Hicks, the American comedian who openly tackled politics during this same period, also died untimely !!??


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 6:48 pm 
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Eric Vaxxine wrote:
I think that maybe FZ was looking at the big picture. Although self critical, remember, this was the guy who encouraged the late 60's early 70's audience to ' register to vote '.

Musicians in the late 1960's had the attention of governmental officials because they were able to reach great masses of people. Certainly FZ knew this. I recall something to the effect that, Zappa, being not only very talented but also politically aware, was expected by his 1960's/early 1970's audience to generate political change ... I personally believe that he realised he was never going to influence politics in a major way through his music and earning a living to support his family was his more immediate concern. Hence the financially successful, non political Overnite Sensation and Apostrophe albums from the early 1970's.

Once self supportive, you all know about his re-emergence into politics in the 1980's. He overtly tackled governmental issues through music on the Broadway the Hardway album. I also recall reading somewhere that the 'powers' were very concerned about his openly critical opinion during this period and followed him closely. He died not long after that.

Strangely (to me), Bill Hicks, the American comedian who openly tackled politics during this same period, also died untimely !!??


I think this quote might be appropriate here:

If children knew what their parents were really like, they'd kill them in their sleep. -- Frank Zappa

Imo, FZ was always more concerned with societal change in general than political change in specific.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2006 5:32 pm 
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Two quotes from FZ that I still live by:
If you don't like something (musically) read up on it (study it) so you know why you don't like it.

And apparently he advised his offspring to think about whether
people were getting paid to say the things they were saying. (ie adverts...)

And of course Jazz is not dead ...!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2006 3:01 pm 
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FZ also said that his entire career was one big failure. The thing is that he had extremely grandiose concepts; apparently none of what was actually realized measured up to the business in his head. This may be hard for some to appreciate; unfortunately (for me) I understand EXACTLY what he meant.


This was probably in light of the Uncle Meat Movie and all of the 12 album boxed sets he planned to release.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 3:57 pm 
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in 1968, FZ wrote:
The instrumentation of the ideal Mothers rock and roll band is two piccolos, two flutes, two bass flutes, two oboes, English horn, three bassoons, a contrabassoon, four clarinets (with the fourth player doubling on alto clarinet), bass clarinet, contrabass clarinet, soprano, alto, tenor, baritone and bass saxophones, four trumpets, four French horns, three trombones, one bass trombone, one tuba, one contrabass tuba, two harps, two keyboard men playing piano, electric piano, electric harpsichord, electric clavichord, Hammond organ, celeste, and piano bass, ten first violins, ten second violins, eight violas, six cellos, four string bass, four percussionists playing twelve timpani, chimes, gongs, field drums, bass drums, snare drums, woodblocks, lion's roar, vibes, xylophone and marimba, three electric guitars, one electric 12-string guitar, electric bass and electric bass guitar and two drummers at sets, plus vocalists who play tambourines.

The Incredible History Of The Mothers

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 Post subject: FZ on FZ
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 4:05 pm 
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He didn't think he could sing all that well. He also didn't consider himself a great guitarist because he said he has to look at the fretboard. I don't know about this one. I've seen him live and have seen clips of him and he isn't always looking at the fretboard. What do you think?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 2:50 pm 
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In the New York Times in around 1970, Frank said he had a big plan
and was about one-third of the way through...
I'm guessing that he did not accomplish all the rest...


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 4:15 pm 
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It seems to me that Zappa wasn't an egoist, he was actually occasionally humble and, perhaps more to the point, honest. He said he wasn't a good guitarist. Obviously, many of us disagree, but possibly Zappa wasn't able to fulfill his own grand desires for his ability. Mike Keneally and Arthur Barrow both mention that Zappa was a master of being able to create situations where he didn't have to do things he had difficulty doing, like reading music and playing it on the guitar.

He knew he wasn't a 'great' singer, but he knew his voice had a certain appeal that would work, so he used it in much of his material.

He knew he was a good composer-- there was a quote I remember hearing where he said something to the effect of 'I'm a good composer. I know that. I'm good at putting things together. That's what I do, and I'm good at it. If you don't like it, that's it. Taste.'

Zappa saw his music as 'entertainment' music, right? For most people, that has negative connotations (as in, 'not serious' music) but I never saw it that way. I think rather that Zappa became a composer in a time when 'entertaining' people with music wasn't really a priority, when things were getting so abstract and conceptual that sound didn't really factor in anymore. Zappa reminded people that his music existed for entertainment, and was only good insofar as it achieved that (Which, I think it did!). His isn't the music that you keep in a dusty folder and pull out to impress people with 'crazy harmonies'. It's music for magic.
(Reminds me of something Harry Partch said- "If my music has any interesting harmonic or structural aspects, that is a coincidence.")

I mean, obviously Zappa had an interest in 20th century abstract materials, but look at who he did admire in that field..! They were all people who were concerned with sound, not theory. (Or, at least, and more accuratley, theory as a subset of sound.)

That's my take on shit.


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