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[quote author=fz link=board=quotes;num=1054510076;start=0#0 date=?]Musicians left to their own devices are incredibly lazy. Outside of sea slugs, I don't think there's any species less oriented towards punctuality[/quote]<br><br>[quote author=fz re:don preston winjing about frank swiping his concepts link=board=quotes;num=1054510076;start=0#0 date=?]The guy plays in my band. I pay him $250 a week, sure I can borrow anything from him....[sub]no commercial potential[/sub][/quote]<br><br>[quote author=fz re: beefheart link=board=quotes;num=1054510076;start=0#0 date=?].....I think Don is fantastic but he's unmarketable.[/quote]<br><br>[quote author=fz re: zubin mehta/200 motels link=board=quotes;num=1054510076;start=0#0 date=jul 4 '70]Oh, that went along just fine, but Zubin is the really publicity-seeking, would-be playbot image. Wants to be  a big star with all the kids.....[sub]NME[/sub][/quote]<br><br>

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I have heard almost ten days ago a radio program celebrating Frank Zappa and his "jazzy" tunes.<br>The journalist quoted a Frank's judgement on John McLaughlin playing. Something "John is only able to play too fast, like a machin-gun".<br>I was sad.<br>In fact I love Frank's music and also Frank's thinking (as far as I can judge on the basis of books, interviews etc.), but I think that McLaughlin is a great guitarist, with a "rapid soul". <br>I think that Frank said that at the times of "Mahavishnu Orchestra". If this is correct, Frank was right (in my opinion) because, with the exception of some tunes in the first Mahavishnu album, Mahavishnu Orchestra records were boring, real "machine-gun" solos etc.<br>But please, listen to McLaughlin solo on "Shhh/Peaceful" on Miles Davis' "In a silent Way". And listen to "Belo Horizonte" album (by J. McLaughlin). He is a great guitarist. Certainly not a good composer.<br>Does anyone knows when Frank Zappa made that judgement on McLaughlin ?<br>Thanks in advance folks

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I love monstermovies..and the cheaper they are the better they are.

[quote author=monstermovie link=board=quotes;num=1054510076;start=0#2 date=12/12/03 at 14:01:42]...Does anyone knows when Frank Zappa made that judgement on McLaughlin...[/quote]<br><br>[quote author=zappa link=board=quotes;num=1054510076;start=0#3 date=the 1977 interview: One Size Fits All ]steve rosen: [font=courier new]What about the contemporary heavies, like Jeff Beck or John McLaughlin?[/font] <br><br>[font=arial black]zappa[/font]: [font=courier]I like Jeff, yeah. I've listened to Wired, and there are a couple of solos on there that I like. And I like some of his stuff on Rough and Ready. <br><br>A person would be a moron not to appreciate McLaughlin's technique. The guy has certainly found out how to operate a guitar as if it were a machine gun. But I'm not always enthusiastic about the lines I hear or the ways in which they're used. I don't think you can fault him, though, for the amount of time and effort it must have taken to play an instrument that fast. <br><br>I think anybody who can play that fast is just wonderful. And I'm sure 90% of teenage America would agree, since the whole trend in the business has been "faster is better."[/font] [/quote]<br><br>maybe mcLaughlin is the original stunt guitarist <br><br>i used to be a big fan of j.m. especially in the shakti years, but nothing lately has been able to match the early years....saw the secret chord progression tour with devadip when they came thru town

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[quote author=slime.oofytv.set link=board=quotes;num=1054510076;start=0#3 date=12/12/03 at 20:40:28]<br><br><br>maybe mcLaughlin is the original stunt guitarist <br><br>i used to be a big fan of j.m. especially in the shakti years, but nothing lately has been able to match the early years....saw the secret chord progression tour with devadip when they came thru town[/quote]<br><br><br>Thanks for the information. So, it was in 1977...quite later the Mahavishnu Orchestra (with Jan Hammer, Billy Cobham, Jerry Goodman...).<br>Pity.<br>I think that Frank was not aware of other McLaughlin performances, namely those with Miles which, to me, are his best, together with his 1982 (?) record "Belo Horizonte".<br>I know badly the Shakti period because I do not like so much the mix between music and mysticism. Certainly I have missed something as far as music is concerned.<br>But McLaughlin has also performed good music around 1994 in trio together with Joey Di Francesco and Dennis Chambers. I went to <br>

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I love monstermovies..and the cheaper they are the better they are.

[quote author=slime.oofytv.set link=board=quotes;num=1054510076;start=0#3 date=12/12/03 at 20:40:28]<br><br><br>maybe mcLaughlin is the original stunt guitarist <br><br>i used to be a big fan of j.m. especially in the shakti years, but nothing lately has been able to match the early years....saw the secret chord progression tour with devadip when they came thru town[/quote]<br><br>OK, thanks. So it was in 1977, quite later than Mahavishnu Orchestra (with Jan Hammer, Jerry Goodman, Billy Cobham...).<br>Pity, I think that Frank was not aware of previous McLaughlin performances, namely with Miles (i.e. those I personally prefer together with his 1982  ??? record Belo Horizonte).<br>I know quite badly the Shakti period because I, personally, do not like the mix between music, mysticism, exotic religions etc. (this is personal). Certainly I missed good music and I will folow your suggestion.<br>JML has also played good music around 1994 in trio with Joey Di Francesco and Dennis Chambers. I went to a concert of this trio and I was really impressed not by the "machin gun" playing of JML (and Di Francesco too) but by the real good feeling.<br>I do not agree with Frank (and I am very sad about this) about the time McLaughlin would have spent to play so fast. JML technique is far from a correct one. His fingers move on the board in a potentially non-fast way. I think it is simply his personal attitude, nothing more.<br>Probably Frank has taken JML fast playing as a "symbol" because he refers to the musical  industry etc. In this sense I agree with Frank who, I guess (but who knows ?) was also reluctant to the Mahavishnu - Shakti mysticism.<br>Ciao<br>

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I love monstermovies..and the cheaper they are the better they are.

Sorry, for reading twce the beginning of my message. :-X<br>I was not aware that after its disappearance (I badly took up on the keyboard) the message was also on the forum.<br>I began a new one......now I have learned how this system works.

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I love monstermovies..and the cheaper they are the better they are.

This may be an odd thing to take away from this thread, but for such a small amount of people actually writing in it, it's been read almost 10,000 times!!! Jeepers.  :o

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One two, buckle my shoe!

Hey Monstermovie, this is what Frank said when he was asked about JM a few years later:<br><br>Q: John McLaughlin? <br><br>FZ: I've met John. I think he's a great guitar player and I think that he's probably done a lot to educate American audiences to some aspects of Eastern music... <br><br> ;D

100,000 when I looked.<br><br>what the f***??

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[quote author=trendm0nger link=board=quotes;num=1054510076;start=15#16 date=07/01/04 at 21:12:19]100,000 when I looked.<br><br>what the f***??[/quote]<br>Topic: Re: zappa on musicians or other band members  (Read 101024 times) <br><br>1024 hits in 5 days...not bad.

As far as FZ and John McLaughlin:<br><br>Whoever posted that quote from him about McLaughlin educating young Westerners about Eastern music got to the heart of it.  I've always gotten the impression that FZ appreciate McLaughlin's scholarship of theory and technique, even if he sometimes thought John played, as they say, "Tumeni Notes" (and, let's face it, everyone in Mahavishnu really could've used a lesson in when to shut up and take a breath).

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It sure is slippery in the percussion section today. . . .

The guitar soloing on the Waka/Jawaka album (especially on "Big Swifty" and the title track) always sounded somewhat inspired by McLaughlin / Mahavishnu to my ears. In any case, FZs playing style seems to have evolved, when compared to the Flo and Eddie years.

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"When you hear music, after it's over, it's gone in the air. You can never capture it again." -- Eric Dolphy

http://www.frappr.com/frankzappaforum - FZ Forum World Map

[quote author=8_Oz_Wings link=board=quotes;num=1054510076;start=15#17 date=10/01/05 at 20:00:26]As far as FZ and John McLaughlin:<br><br>Whoever posted that quote from him about McLaughlin educating young Westerners about Eastern music got to the heart of it.  I've always gotten the impression that FZ appreciate McLaughlin's scholarship of theory and technique, even if he sometimes thought John played, as they say, "Tumeni Notes" (and, let's face it, everyone in Mahavishnu really could've used a lesson in when to shut up and take a breath).[/quote]<br>Yeah, we should make them change their completly original and individual styles so they will no longer be the most incredible/techniquely developed band thats ever been....sounds like a plan.

LOOK: there are TWELVE PITCH CLASSES-DELETE 3 THEN YOU HAVE ...nine...play these over & over again..thus there is a MODE...

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For the record, Zappa's comment about John McLaughlin was not that he could ONLY play fast or that he played the guitar like a machine gun. There are plenty of examples of McLaughlin guitar work that is not fast. We all know that Zappa liked to get some twisted things out of a guitar (sounds that would get record company executives choking on each others dick is roughly one way he put it) and what he said about McLaughlin was that he made the GUITAR SOUND like a machine gun. What would that do to a record company executive?<br><br>The thing about this thread and numbers that have read it must have to do with missing posts, I believe the thread began a long time ago and the data files for the thread have become corrupt. It was 252, 026 just before I posted this message.

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The way I see it Barry, this should be a very dynamite show.

I don't know why this thread got floated to the top, but in the mean time, I can't remember where someone else has also quoted a Zappa interview where he spoke quite highly of John McLaughlin's playing. To get where Zappa was coming from on most issues generally requires a bit of research and much more than just one offhand quote.

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The way I see it Barry, this should be a very dynamite show.