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 Post subject: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Sun Feb 01, 2009 10:02 am 
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anybody else on here enjoy the flo and eddie era the most out of all of his music? i'm still trying to complete my collection of "official" releases. so far the usual:
chungas revenge
200 motels
live at fillmore east
just another band from la
btb tengo na minchia tanta
btb swiss cheese/fire!
ycdtosa 1
200 motels vhs + dvd

still need to get:
playground psychotics
ycdtosa 6
btb disconected synapses
true story of 200 motels dvd :wink:

anything else i may be missing? i'm not really concerned with btb freaks and mother$%$, it has the same songs as tengo. i just heard a concert from the filmore west on wolfgangsvault.com that i would love to get on cd. it has the only flo and eddie version of easy meat (that i've heard). i know on the internet there are lots people that find them irritating, but i think they're the best singers frank worked with. i also enjoy the lo-fi quality of the music, like having a smaller band.


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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Sun Feb 01, 2009 2:27 pm 
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Though it's not my favorite FZ era, it's still a great one! Could be the most underestimated. The arrangements are wonderful and the band always seem to have a lot of fun. Out of all the BTB's I think Swiss Cheese/Fire! is the best one. With the sofa suite and all ;)

And that fillmore west concert you talked about, I have it on a bootleg. If you mean the one including "Have Gun Will Travel, Gris Gris Gumbo Ya Ya, Easy Meat and Bullshit (audience participation)? I think you can find it on zappateers, It's a good one :)

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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Sun Feb 01, 2009 4:44 pm 
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thank you! :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Sun Feb 01, 2009 8:45 pm 
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Be sure to look for the audience recording of the Pauley Pavillion show on August 7, 1971. This is, of course, the " Just Another Band From LA" show.

The reason you want the audience recording is because it contains the full, unedited version of "Billy The Mountain:" all 42 minutes of it. After this you'll want to run off to your local Google and find out who George Putnam is (or was; he died just a few months ago).

Later in the show, Jimmy Carl Black came out and did "Lonesome Cowboy Burt."

But you'll soon get sick of hearing the taper breathe into the microphone...

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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 6:40 am 
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MentalTossFlycoon wrote:
The reason you want the audience recording is because it contains the full, unedited version of "Billy The Mountain:" all 42 minutes of it.


I think it's more like 34 minutes.


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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 7:57 am 
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MentalTossFlycoon wrote:
But you'll soon get sick of hearing the taper breathe into the microphone...

Admit it, Mental....it was turning you on.

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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 5:35 pm 
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i'll have to check it out. it'll be interesting to hear it before zappa overdubbed all over it.


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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 6:11 pm 
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No overdubs on the entire JABFLA album. However, FZ edited out the solos from Billy The Mountain, as well as references to George Putnam (as MentalTossFlycoon mentioned) presumably due to libel concerns, and some other bits.


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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 6:58 pm 
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you'll love Playground Psychotics, this is one of my favorite eras as well!


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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 7:47 pm 
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MentalTossFlycoon wrote:
Be sure to look for the audience recording of the Pauley Pavillion show on August 7, 1971. This is, of course, the " Just Another Band From LA" show.

The reason you want the audience recording is because it contains the full, unedited version of "Billy The Mountain:" all 42 minutes of it. After this you'll want to run off to your local Google and find out who George Putnam is (or was; he died just a few months ago).

Later in the show, Jimmy Carl Black came out and did "Lonesome Cowboy Burt."

But you'll soon get sick of hearing the taper breathe into the microphone...


Maybe if we get around to a MOJABFLA we'll be able to hear the whole thing in pristine audio.


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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 3:57 pm 
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i've only read ppl talking shit about this era, so its good to see others that love it too. i wonder why ppl skip over this year and a half? my guess is that people prefer the music driven side of zappa, and this was mostly vocal driven...
there's no overdubs on jabfla at all? not even backing vocals? i can tell live from filmore east has backing vocals dubbed (a la tears began to fall)
i've also read that jabfla was intended as a double live album, so maybe we'll get that sometime.

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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 4:42 pm 
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manichispanic wrote:
there's no overdubs on jabfla at all? not even backing vocals? i can tell live from filmore east has backing vocals dubbed (a la tears began to fall)


FZ mentioned this in a Down Beat interview from 1978 (available here):
Quote:
Schneckloth: It seem like you've done a lot of live albums over the years.
Zappa: Some of them have been totally live, some have had orchestration added on. Fillmore East was about 90% pure live; Just Another Band From L.A. was 100%. That was a four-track recording right off the p.a. Roxy And Elsewhere had some things that were live, some were overdubbed.


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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 4:44 pm 
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manichispanic wrote:
i've only read ppl talking shit about this era, so its good to see others that love it too. i wonder why ppl skip over this year and a half? my guess is that people prefer the music driven side of zappa, and this was mostly vocal driven...
there's no overdubs on jabfla at all? not even backing vocals? i can tell live from filmore east has backing vocals dubbed (a la tears began to fall)
i've also read that jabfla was intended as a double live album, so maybe we'll get that sometime.


You don't have to take this as bible truth, but I believe Fillmore was a multirack (16 track) recording and I read on a Barry Keene site (he was the recording engineer on JABFLA) that this was done on 4 track (maybe 2) with microphones placed in various spots on stage. No isolated tracks - making overdubbing a bit more tricky. Not impossible to add but impossible to delete without losing the entire piece of music. I couldn't find the web page where he descirbed the techniques he used, so I'm going by memory, but iirc. mic placement was crucial. Would love to here the entire set, JABFLA is my fave FLo & Eddie album.


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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 5:13 pm 
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manichispanic wrote:
anybody else on here enjoy the flo and eddie era the most out of all of his music?

it's my least favorite era.

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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 5:14 pm 
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What is this ??



unreleased 2nd lp from just another band from la


Side Three
Billy The Mountain (cont.)
Studebacher Hoch
The Conclusion
The Subcutaneous Peril

Side Four
"An Easy Substitute For Eternity Itself"
Don's Solo
Ian's Solo
Aynsley's Solo
Frank's Solo


Frank Zappa JABFLA UNRELEASED 2ND LP (download torrent) - TPBFrank Zappa JABFLA UNRELEASED 2ND LP. Type: Audio > Music; Files: 4; Size: 276.91 MiB (290364019 Bytes). Quality: +0 / -0 (0); Uploaded: 2005-08-24 12:55:52 ...
thepiratebay.org/torrent/3373992/Frank_Zappa_JABFLA_UNRELEASED_2ND_LP - 13k -

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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 5:34 pm 
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Found the answer :wink:

http://www.zappateers.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=14590


Frank Zappa and the Mothers of Invention
"Just Another Band From L.A.", second (unreleased) LP
Remastered Edition

This is a remastered version of this post: http://www.zappateers.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=2321

Frank Zappa had originally envisioned "Just Another Band From L.A." as a double album.
Acetates of this album were pressed and given to the band members. For whatever reasons,
plans for that 2 LP set were abandoned and they went with the single LP that we know
and love.

A significant difference in "Billy the Mountain" was that Zappa removed an 8:51 section of
singing and solos in order to fit it onto a single side of an LP. The 33:38 original was
now only 24:47.

I've taken the circulating copy of that second LP and tried to improve it somewhat. Using
iZotope's *SPAM*, I applied moderate declicking to remove some of the clicks and crackles from
the acetate copy. (It was actually fairly clean already.) I also removed a low level
15735Hz VHS HiFi modulation signal (indicating that the acetate was probably recorded onto
a VHS recorder). I then used iZotope's Ozone 3 to more closely match the acetate's EQ to
that of the Rykodisc CD.

Most importantly though, I've also created an extract from "Billy the Mountain Pt. 2" of
just the material cut from the original version. Those comfortable with audio editors
can simply drop this extract into the released version to recreate the full length track.
Because of the EQ matching, the edit is near seamless. Notes on how to do this are below.

Lineage: acetate > VHS recorder(?) > ??? > FLAC > WAV (Adobe Audition) > FLAC

Track List:

1. Studebaker Hoch~Billy The Mountain Pt.2 [RM] 13:57
2. The Subcutaneous Peril (1970-10-11) [RM] 5:19
3. An Easy Substitute For Eternity Itself (1970-10-11) [RM] 20:23
4. Billy The Mountain (extract) 8:51

"Billy the Mountain" was recorded on August 7, 1971, at Pauley Pavilion, UCLA, CA.
"The Subcutaneous Peril" and "An Easy Substitute" were recorded at Carnegie Hall on
October 11, 1971.

From Zappa's notes, this is what the original intended album would have looked like.

Side One
1. "Call Any Vegetable" (Zappa) 7:22
2. "Eddie, Are You Kidding?" (Kaylan, Seiler, Volman, Zappa) 3:09
3. "Magdalena" (Kaylan, Zappa) 6:24
4. "Dog Breath" (Zappa) 3:37

Side Two
1. "Billy the Mountain" (Zappa) 19:41

Side Three
1. "Billy the Mountain" (cont.) 13:57
Studebacher Hoch
The Conclusion
2. "The Subcutaneous Peril" (Zappa) 5:19

Side Four
1. "An Easy Substitute For Eternity Itself" (Zappa, Preston, Underwood, Dunbar, Pons) 20:23
Don's Solo
Ian's Solo
Aynsley's Solo
Frank's Solo

For completists, three additional tracks from Pauley Pavilion have been released:
* "Divan" (1:46) on Playground Psychotics
* "The Groupie Routine" (5:41) on YCDTOSA Vol. 1
* "200 Motels Finale" (3:43) on YCDTOSA Vol. 6
"Lonesome Cowbody Nano" a composite from Pauley Pavilion and a 1988 show is also
on YCDTOSA Vol. 6

*==> Recreating "Billy the Mountain" <==*

All that needs to be done is to locate the edit point in the official track and copy the
new insert, "4 - Billy The Mountain (extract).flac" into the track at that point. In my
copy, that occurs in the Studebacher Hock section at 20:49:14314. It is IMMEDIATELY before
the words, "I don't know". If inserted properly, this will be a seamless edit. As part of
this post, I have included six screen shots showing tighter and tighter zooms on the edit
point so you can see EXACTLY where the new insert needs to go. I use Adobe Audition, but
Audacity, an excellent free, open source, cross-platform audio editor, does the job equally
well.
http://audacity.sourceforge.net/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audacity

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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 6:52 pm 
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Lumpy Gravy wrote:
manichispanic wrote:
anybody else on here enjoy the flo and eddie era the most out of all of his music?

it's my least favorite era.

So you don't enjoy it?

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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 7:19 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2007 7:24 am
Posts: 139
I can understand why people would get tired of this era (how many times can YOU listen to the groupie routine? seriously?) but at the same time this was an amazing band. Probably the best straight forward rock & roll band Frank ever put together. There is some fantastic jamming, Ian, George & Ansley were perfect musicians for FZ at that time. The neat thing (to me) about this era is Frank is just starting to transition from a more straight blues styled sound on guitar to his more experimental and technically adventurous sound that defined his guitar playing for the rest of his career. It's really fun stuff to listen to but the live bootlegs definitely do suffer from the heavy rotation syndrome. Some of the Howard & Mark-centric stuff is just too damn long to hear over and over again every show.


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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 7:35 pm 
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Posts: 434
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pedro1 wrote:
Found the answer :wink:

http://www.zappateers.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=14590


Frank Zappa and the Mothers of Invention
"Just Another Band From L.A.", second (unreleased) LP
Remastered Edition

This is a remastered version of this post: http://www.zappateers.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=2321

Frank Zappa had originally envisioned "Just Another Band From L.A." as a double album.
Acetates of this album were pressed and given to the band members. For whatever reasons,
plans for that 2 LP set were abandoned and they went with the single LP that we know
and love.

A significant difference in "Billy the Mountain" was that Zappa removed an 8:51 section of
singing and solos in order to fit it onto a single side of an LP. The 33:38 original was
now only 24:47.

I've taken the circulating copy of that second LP and tried to improve it somewhat. Using
iZotope's *SPAM*, I applied moderate declicking to remove some of the clicks and crackles from
the acetate copy. (It was actually fairly clean already.) I also removed a low level
15735Hz VHS HiFi modulation signal (indicating that the acetate was probably recorded onto
a VHS recorder). I then used iZotope's Ozone 3 to more closely match the acetate's EQ to
that of the Rykodisc CD.

Most importantly though, I've also created an extract from "Billy the Mountain Pt. 2" of
just the material cut from the original version. Those comfortable with audio editors
can simply drop this extract into the released version to recreate the full length track.
Because of the EQ matching, the edit is near seamless. Notes on how to do this are below.

Lineage: acetate > VHS recorder(?) > ??? > FLAC > WAV (Adobe Audition) > FLAC

Track List:

1. Studebaker Hoch~Billy The Mountain Pt.2 [RM] 13:57
2. The Subcutaneous Peril (1970-10-11) [RM] 5:19
3. An Easy Substitute For Eternity Itself (1970-10-11) [RM] 20:23
4. Billy The Mountain (extract) 8:51

"Billy the Mountain" was recorded on August 7, 1971, at Pauley Pavilion, UCLA, CA.
"The Subcutaneous Peril" and "An Easy Substitute" were recorded at Carnegie Hall on
October 11, 1971.

From Zappa's notes, this is what the original intended album would have looked like.

Side One
1. "Call Any Vegetable" (Zappa) 7:22
2. "Eddie, Are You Kidding?" (Kaylan, Seiler, Volman, Zappa) 3:09
3. "Magdalena" (Kaylan, Zappa) 6:24
4. "Dog Breath" (Zappa) 3:37

Side Two
1. "Billy the Mountain" (Zappa) 19:41

Side Three
1. "Billy the Mountain" (cont.) 13:57
Studebacher Hoch
The Conclusion
2. "The Subcutaneous Peril" (Zappa) 5:19

Side Four
1. "An Easy Substitute For Eternity Itself" (Zappa, Preston, Underwood, Dunbar, Pons) 20:23
Don's Solo
Ian's Solo
Aynsley's Solo
Frank's Solo

For completists, three additional tracks from Pauley Pavilion have been released:
* "Divan" (1:46) on Playground Psychotics
* "The Groupie Routine" (5:41) on YCDTOSA Vol. 1
* "200 Motels Finale" (3:43) on YCDTOSA Vol. 6
"Lonesome Cowbody Nano" a composite from Pauley Pavilion and a 1988 show is also
on YCDTOSA Vol. 6

*==> Recreating "Billy the Mountain" <==*

All that needs to be done is to locate the edit point in the official track and copy the
new insert, "4 - Billy The Mountain (extract).flac" into the track at that point. In my
copy, that occurs in the Studebacher Hock section at 20:49:14314. It is IMMEDIATELY before
the words, "I don't know". If inserted properly, this will be a seamless edit. As part of
this post, I have included six screen shots showing tighter and tighter zooms on the edit
point so you can see EXACTLY where the new insert needs to go. I use Adobe Audition, but
Audacity, an excellent free, open source, cross-platform audio editor, does the job equally
well.
http://audacity.sourceforge.net/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audacity


Alright, now how do I download this thing!?


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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 8:38 pm 
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manichispanic wrote:
anybody else on here enjoy the flo and eddie era the most out of all of his music?
Lumpy Gravy wrote:
it's my least favorite era.
just plain doug wrote:
So you don't enjoy it?
it's my least favorite era of frank zappa music. capice?

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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 10:53 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 7:14 am
Posts: 18956
Location: Kitchener, Ontario, CANADA
Lumpy Gravy wrote:
manichispanic wrote:
anybody else on here enjoy the flo and eddie era the most out of all of his music?
Lumpy Gravy wrote:
it's my least favorite era.
just plain doug wrote:
So you don't enjoy it?
it's my least favorite era of frank zappa music. capice?

Just filling in for Trendy. :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 6:16 am 
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I'm going to see Flo and Eddie at the Skagit Casino in Washington on February 20. I'm gonna see if I can get my 200 motels vinyl signed.


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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 6:25 am 
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Posts: 357
Location: Mons Venus
manichispanic wrote:
anybody else on here enjoy the flo and eddie era the most out of all of his music?


It was kind of like my adolescent gateway drug to FZ's ouevre. I still find the flo and eddie material entertaining after more than three decades.


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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 9:56 am 
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Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2009 12:09 pm
Posts: 587
Location: atlanta!
Lumpy Gravy wrote:
manichispanic wrote:
anybody else on here enjoy the flo and eddie era the most out of all of his music?

it's my least favorite era.



i knew there had to be a few ppl on here with this opinion!

as far as jabfla, i'm glad i know now that its a four track recording with no overdubs, that makes it that much more impressive.

and how many times can i listen to the groupie routine? shit tons! but to me i enjoy the overall picture of 200 motels, including the bits zappa couldn't put in the movie due to time constraints, and the fact that his bassist quit. i've studied and read a lot about it and i've put together a tracklist of how 200 motels was originally conceived.

1. would you like a snack?/ holiday in berlin
2. Tuna fish promenade
3.Centerville
4. Would you go all the way?
5. Sealed tuna bolero
6. Lonesome cowboy burt
7. Mystery roach
8. Rudy wants to buy yez a drink
9. shove it right in
a. She painted up her face
b. half a dozen provacative squats
c. shove it right in
10. groupie opera
a. what will this morning, bring me this evening?
b. what kind of girl do you think we are?
c. bwana dik
d. latex solar beef
e. willie the pimp pt. 1
f. daddy, daddy, daddy
g. do you like my new car? (groupie routine)
h. magic fingers
i. what will this evening bring me this morning?
11. 200 motels finale

i skipped over some of the chunga's revenge songs (even though they were intended to be in 200 motels, i think the story changed so the songs are moot) mud shark, and the sealed tuna sanwich prologue and reprise, and penis demension( not really a fan of a song that says penis over and over again :wink:

any suggestions or comments?

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 Post subject: Re: flo and eddie
PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 11:52 am 
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Location: Michigan
Bump!

How do I get the unreleased side two of Just Another Band From L.A.!?


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