Zappa.com

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I have actually given this some thought, I may be wrong, only the ZFT could say for sure. The conclusion I came to was that it was part of the plot line for Them Or Us the book, and a vast majority of songs that were used or described to tell that story were re-mixed on the CD releases. I would think that meant Frank was very much still trying to complete the story for the purpose of conceptual continuity. All you would need to do is program the songs to play in the proper order and you would have the completed soundtrack for the story. This was probably a good way to get the work done without releasing an individual 10+ CD recording that only a very small minority would actually purchase. Again, I might just be over thinking this, and perhaps he did it just because he wanted to hear what he had written. That would seem to have been a theme in a great many of his interviews at the time.

If you heard the vinyl mix first, I would recommend leaving the CD out of circulation for a while, I did for years. When I listened to it again with "new ears" I finally truly appreciated it.

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"Whose foot is to be the measure to which ours are all to be cut or stretched? Is a priest to be our inquisitor, or shall a layman, simple as ourselves, set up his reason as the rule for what we are to read and what we must believe?" T.J.

Having both the vinyl and CD it is as simple as what do I want to hear.
I enjoy each very much for what they each represent.
The Sleep Dirt CD is only a brief glimpse into Hunchentoot.
I'd love to see Hunchentoot as envisioned by FZ on Broadway.
Yes in Surround Sound.
Disbanding the Mothers was progress.

The Thana Harris Vocals are only what is used for the realization of a few songs
which are not the exact arrangement as would be done in the play.
I like the Sleep Dirt CD for what it is but the play had 42 member cast including musicians and is done in two acts.
Some of these complainers would be begging for the release if FZ had never put it out.
They would be screaming for GZ to release the Sleep Dirt CD with vocals.

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Trendmonger's Moment Of Clarity

FZ "Read It And Weep"
April 17,1981

Frank Zappa left the ZFT in Control of his Vaults and Artistic rights.
We the fans are not in control. We have a choice to use our eyes and ears or read it and weep.

not me!

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Who's this dude with his hair straight back?
His new white socks, 'n his pants all black
His T-shirts rolled His watch is gold
A '55 Chevy that his brother just stoled

Come on Trendy. Most folks on this forum would love to have absolutely everything that Frank had ever recorded, all concert tapes, all the interviews, magazine articles etc etc. I would guess that the majority of folks on this forum are long-term fans, who by and large appreciate[i][/i] everything that FZ did, or at least tried to do.
But, some of his tunes weren't as strong as others, either in concept or execution. It's ok to have favourites, and it's ok to regard some of it as dreck. Sure, it's all part of the P/O, but some of it is more FUN.
Some of us also listen to music that has nothing to do with FZ. You know. We have perspective.

As one of the other posters noted, when someone post a message saying such and such a song is good/bad it usually makes me want to re-explore that track, and listen to it more closely, perhaps seeing it in a different context. Sometimes my opinion might then change as I get a different perspective. Sometimes my opinions are reaffirmed.
Ultimately, who gives a shit anyway. It is just entertainment.

Guy

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Guy Cool

Best Statement of the Year

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Good writing is clear writing.

I really don't like "Night School"..... it reminds me of bad 80's music..........
also on list;
Promiscuous
.....hmmmm
I can't think of another bad FZ tune that I wouldn't listen to regularly.

NP

I am still waiting to hear it. One of the few things I have deliberately avoided (as I love Sleep Dirt). Then, I have sort of forgotten about it. Maýbe I should give it a try soon.

BTW: "Flambay" was performed with lyrics by the 1974 band (maybe just once in Göteborg on 9/25?). So, yes, it has been part of the conceptual continuity all along. Strange that a version with Napoleon singing has never officially appeared.

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"Everybody in this room is wearing a uniform, and don't kid yourself" - FZ
http://www.myspace.com/kirnehness

I'd love to hear "Night School" performed by humans. I think it's a great composition, but that Synclavier tone hasn't aged particularly well.

According to Nigey Lennon's book FZ tried to find a female singer to record the songs in 1974, but the people who auditioned either couldn't cut it or were offended by the lyrics.

Nightschool is grest IMHO ! Check out the guy playing the melody on guitar on youtube, really sounds good !

Check out the version on the 'Zappa's Universe' disc-I love it.
It was also on the EM Greggery Peccary disc.

As for the synclavier version, it was one of the tracks that made me want to learn 'sequencing' with Cubase etc and its harmony, built on fifths (I think. I'm not a musicologist) really appealed to my ear. The Bickford film was cool as well.
It's another top 10, or at least top 20, tune for me.

Guy

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Guy Cool

I'd say everything he recorded between June 1970 and December 1971, except for the 200 Motels interludes.

So, any other opinions on Manx Needs Women? Does anyone out there really like it?

As for the Sleep Dirt vocal version, I for one like them. Nothing anyone says here is the final word on anything FZ did, least of all what I say, but they are not a mistake in my view, especially given that the instrumental versions are available on Läther for anyone who desires them.

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The way I see it Barry, this should be a very dynamite show.

If I'm not mistaken Manx Needs Women is actually Approximate. As an idea Approximate really intrigues me, setting up a rhythm for the musicians to play but allowing them to then choose their own tones, thus resulting in a slightly or perhaps greatly different experience every single time. I truly enjoy the diversity of the piece. I would have to say that I really like Manx Needs Women as it was the first instance of the composition I heard.

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"Whose foot is to be the measure to which ours are all to be cut or stretched? Is a priest to be our inquisitor, or shall a layman, simple as ourselves, set up his reason as the rule for what we are to read and what we must believe?" T.J.

Manx Needs Women is a piece that Zappa wrote for an interview in Guitar Player magazine as a demonstration of the complex rhythms he dabbled with. It wasn't originally intended for performance, but he decided later to develop it and get the band to play it. On Zappa In New York, which is where Manx Needs Women can be found, the Purple Lagoon track actually has an approximate incorporated in it.

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The way I see it Barry, this should be a very dynamite show.

you crazy! the live stuff from this era is bad ass!

but i don't really like the sofa suite, kind boring. but stick it out came from this, so that makes it a little better

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Who's this dude with his hair straight back?
His new white socks, 'n his pants all black
His T-shirts rolled His watch is gold
A '55 Chevy that his brother just stoled

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Thank you for the correction.

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"Whose foot is to be the measure to which ours are all to be cut or stretched? Is a priest to be our inquisitor, or shall a layman, simple as ourselves, set up his reason as the rule for what we are to read and what we must believe?" T.J.

"Manx Needs Women" is great.

i don't really like "Honey, don't you want a man like me","illionois enema bandit" and "dumb all over"

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Who's this dude with his hair straight back?
His new white socks, 'n his pants all black
His T-shirts rolled His watch is gold
A '55 Chevy that his brother just stoled

I like the 'Honey,...' version where he calls her the 'unt' word.
FWIW 'Dumb all over' is really good too.

But, 'Advance Romance' is boring.

That's my tuppence for the day.


Quilt

The track "Weasles Ripped My Flesh" i used as a wake up call, so i hear it every morning, five day's a week.
I F*cking hate it

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Sometimes it seems like there isn't enough time in the day to not do all the things that need not doing

The first version of "Dumb All Over" I heard was the live cut on Have I Offended Someone. When I got around to hearing the album version a few years later, I was really disappointed. I grew to like it, but man, that live version blows it out of the water.

Reading this just reminded me that when I was in college I'd sneak into my little brothers room when he was asleep in the morning and play Are You Hung Up at loud volume to wake him up. He so loved me for it.

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I can't tell when you're telling the truth.
>I'm not.
How do I know anything you've said to me is...
>You don't.