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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 8:34 pm 
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This is a thread to discuss the live shows that The Mothers did with Flo & Eddie, documented by such albums as Fillmore East, Just Another Band From LA and Playground Psychotics. I personally love them, and I'm going to see Flo & Eddie on the Happy Together Tour in a couple months! What does everyone else think of them?


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 6:44 am 
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It's not my favorite period, but I don't dislike them. Do you have Carnegie Hall yet?

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 8:17 am 
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I like the solos and some of the songs. The shrieking is a bit much at times though.....

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:40 am 
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They amuse me, really. But I'm not all that much in the mudshark stories and the groupie tales.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 5:59 pm 
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For a very long period of my life "Fillmore East, June 1971" was my favourite album, but then I was a male youth at the time, go figure. I still think it's a great album. But then again, I guess I'm lucky because I like all of FZ's stuff whatever the genre, whatever the period. I became a fan in the early seventies and there were one or two times while he was alive that a new album disappointed me on the first listen but even that didn't last long. Hey, I've even grown to like Thing Fish. But, I'm not a fanatic FZ the man fan, mainly a fanatic FZ the composer fan. If I wrote a book about FZ the man, a lot of FZ fans would end up hating me for it.

The Flo and Eddie phase of FZ's career was brought to a very premature end. As John Lennon said, up to a point, "Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans". This is only partly true because quite often good plans do work out and I'm sure that was the case with FZ's career. The catch 22 is that I really like the direction he was forced into by that unplanned incident, not that I would wish that kind of damage even on my worst enemy.

I think the Flo and Eddie era was a good one, it's a pity the hypothetical next album after JABFLA doesn't exist. And I mean the one that doesn't exist, not left over live bits and pieces but the one with newly written material that never came about.

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The way I see it Barry, this should be a very dynamite show.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2012 4:09 am 
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I'd have to say that Flo & Eddie and the original Mothers are tied for my least favorite FZ periods. Although, the Flo & Eddie period did have some great material and they harmonize so smoothly. Here's my favorite Flo & Eddie stuff:

Shove It Right In medley
What Would This Evening Bring Me This Morning?
Billy The Mountain
Magdalena
Tell Me You Love Me


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2012 6:25 pm 
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Billy The Mountain is in my top five favorite Zappa songs! It never ceases to entertain me, and I always end up laughing! :lol:
I even like Flo & Eddie in The Turtles! Elenore, Happy Together, She'd Rather Be With Me... It was silly pop music, but it was all in good humor! :)

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2012 11:20 pm 
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JABFLA is one of my faves largely because of Billy the Mountain.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 9:42 am 
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I love all of JABFLA! It's just such a funny album and it always puts me in a good mood!
IT'S SO FUCKING GREAT TO BE ALIVE! :D

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 4:44 pm 
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This is where different tastes come in to it. Billy The Mountain bores the pants off of me. While I'm on JABFLA, Eddie Are You Kidding is a bit ordinary and Magdelena gets tiresome after a while, but I really like Call Any Vegetable and Dog Breath, they never seem to get old.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2012 7:28 pm 
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Magdalena makes me uncomfortable. The first time I heard it, I enjoyed it alot and thought it was just a pleasant tune. Then I noticed the lyrics. I like the song, but I feel weird enjoying a song about incest, so I don't listen it anymore. It's the only song I skip on JABFLA , besides that, I think it's fantastic!
PS I love Eddie Are You Kidding! Its a stupid song and thats the way I like it! :)

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2012 7:59 pm 
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beajerkgotowork wrote:
Magdalena makes me uncomfortable. The first time I heard it, I enjoyed it alot and thought it was just a pleasant tune. Then I noticed the lyrics. I like the song, but I feel weird enjoying a song about incest, so I don't listen it anymore. It's the only song I skip on JABFLA , besides that, I think it's fantastic!
PS I love Eddie Are You Kidding! Its a stupid song and thats the way I like it! :)

I think in the case of Zappa or a lot of other artists and especially comedians these days, you can't take anything too personally or literally. Most of this stuff is not politically correct to be sure. Bad taste? Sure, but then throw out a lot of the edgy humor that's out there. I think it's natural/healthy to joke about stuff on the dark side or stuff that is unpleasant. That's one of the great joys and benefits (stress reduction) of humor I think.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2012 9:14 pm 
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the year and a half that zappa played with flo and eddie is my favorite of zappa's music. i saw flo and eddie with ZPZ last year and it was amazing!

if you like the albums zappa made in the f&e years, i suggest getting bootlegs of the conerts. look up, "el monte legion stadium" 1970 ( first time they performed the groupie opera, both the late and early fillmore east shows 1970, filmore west 1970, palais gaumont paris 1970, and swiss cheese 1971 (the infamous show that inspired smoke on the water

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 1:44 am 
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Like Ronny's Noomies, I like the solos and some of the tunes (and that does include Billy the Mountain), but two factors made this band sound hysterically lightweight: a) Mark Volman's alto voice and thus lots of screeching and b) the conspicuous near-absence of any horns*, except when George Duke was there to provide some trombone and thus more emphasis on double keyboards: which meant, in the pre-synthesizer days, vibrato-heavy Hammond coupled with slick jazz Rhodes piano. The result sounds like a lightly psychedelic circus music with certain blues/jazz shadings.

The keyboard arrangements improved somewhat once Don Preston joined with his Minimoog. I think by the Fall 71 tour both Don and Ian were using Minimoogs. Billy The Mountain's intro was originally on clarinet, but on JABFLA it sounds like played on a synthesizer. I think this is still Ian that plays the melody, just on a different instrument. I also believe that Ian in fact does the synth-imitation of the "clarinet" for "Sofa No. 1" on YCDTOSA1, rather than really playing the electrified clarinet.

My favorite sequence of music from the F&E band can be heard on Playground Psychotics:
Status Back Baby
Concentration Moon (okay, that Sanzini Bros crap is too much, but I love the new variation added, very Hatfield & The North esque)
Mom & Dad
Intro to Music for Low Budget Orchestra (I guess this was dropped later because Bob Harris must've been a reader, unlike Preston)
Billy The Mountain

*In the summer of 1970 Ian played tenor sax for his "King Kong" solos, then in Aug/Sep he didn't play any sax solos, but by Nov 1970 he had switched over to the soprano saxophone for that one solo per night he would toss as a bone to those freaks hungry for Ian's whip-outs. 1970 was possibly also the last year he used the Maestro Woodwind effects unit, as none of his 1971 solos feature the crazy octave effects. Apparently Ian lost the soprano to the Montreux fire, as his King Kong solo on YCDTOSA3 is on the alto again. As I said, I don't think Ian used the clarinet in the Sofa Suite, but he did for the Low Budget/BTM Intro sequence in May-July 1971.

There's also a revealing comment from FZ himself why he changed the arrangements in 1970:

Quote:
George (Duke) plays trombone on 30 or 40 per cent of the material, and I was never really satisfied with the old horns anyway. They had positive elements, but lacked good intonation within the section. They could read and feel the music, and the solos were generally good, but the ensemble sound was harsh – the ‘bugs’ were put through acoustic amps so it was always a little brash. Amps can alter the feeling so much: if we’d put the horns through Marshalls, it would have been completely different.


So basically FZ wasn't happy with the Gardners/Underwood horn section. Which of course, to some, basically defines the 1968-69 Mothers. I certainly quite dig that "abrasive" horn sound, Soft Machine's "Noisette" CD also featured similar fuzzy sax texture. But I can realize why both Zappa as well as Soft Machine saxophonist Elton Dean must've hated the results of "bugging" the saxes up. By 1973 FZ was capable of amplifying the band's horns better via Barcus Berry pick-up systems. I also wonder if FZ thought that Ian was more reliable as a pianist and an occasional sax soloist rather than as an ensemble horn player.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 11:18 am 
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i remember reading an article with George Duke saying he HATED playing the trombone. when he rejoined the mothers he told frank he would only do it if he didn't have to play any trombone! :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 11:39 am 
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manichispanic wrote:
i remember reading an article with George Duke saying he HATED playing the trombone. when he rejoined the mothers he told frank he would only do it if he didn't have to play any trombone! :mrgreen: :mrgreen:


Well, he certainly must've been grateful for the presence of Bruce Fowler, the ultimate trombone god himself. If Duke himself hated playing the 'bone, then I can see why he never played it in the Bruce-less Fall '74 band.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2012 12:27 pm 
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I appreciate Flo & Eddie very much. Maybe it wasn't Frank's most serious period, but it was quite funny. Would like to see them, too.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2012 1:21 pm 
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beajerkgotowork wrote:
Magdalena makes me uncomfortable. The first time I heard it, I enjoyed it alot and thought it was just a pleasant tune. Then I noticed the lyrics. I like the song, but I feel weird enjoying a song about incest, so I don't listen it anymore. It's the only song I skip on JABFLA , besides that, I think it's fantastic!
PS I love Eddie Are You Kidding! Its a stupid song and thats the way I like it! :)


So, do you have Carnegie Hall?

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2012 6:47 am 
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Look on FZ giglist he was bring Flo+Eddie over too UK just too sing on T-rex T-rex.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2012 10:52 pm 
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wait wait wait wait....


In the Marc Bolan biography it says that the TRex albums were recorded in america, and that flo and eddie rehearsed them in Laurel Canyon around Howard Kaylan's pool

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2012 10:56 pm 
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the TRex albums with flo and eddie i mean

i know how much of a stickler cleon is :roll:

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 1:18 pm 
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did somebody finally shut cleon up? :shock:

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 4:43 pm 
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I've organised the FZ on my iPod into groups. My favourite of course is what I call FZ's core catalog, by which I mean all his main albums like WIIFTM or HR or OSFA or YS, I don't include guitar solo albums or live compilations like TBBYNHIL, YCDTOSA, but ZINY and BWTHW are in there. I listen to the other groups occasionally in whole album chunks.

When I'm out and about I listen to FZ's core catalog on random and I just got the JABFLA Call Any Vegetable the other day. That track seriously kicks arse and really highlights what that particular band was capable of.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 2:20 am 
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manichispanic wrote:
did somebody finally shut cleon up? :shock:

What you retarded thinking(T.rex T.rex) is t.rex albums.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 10:05 am 
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calvin2hikers wrote:
So, do you have Carnegie Hall?

No I do not. Why?

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