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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:43 pm 
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Ronny's Noomies wrote:
I will not be surprised at all if the Dweeze bails in the next year or so.


I think I know what you mean but I'm not sure if I agree. Compared to the first year or two, ZPZ's demand has decreased 30%-50%. The three main reasons for this are that alumni aren't included in the line-up like they were the first couple of years, that they return to the same markets too often and the unfortunate economic crisis we're still enduring. And hence, why Dweezil recently needed to lay-off a few band members (a few "key" members, I might add). Hopefully, you're not right. I would hate to think that could happen. But I guess we'll have to wait and see...

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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 10:07 pm 
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Disco Boy wrote:
Ronny's Noomies wrote:
I will not be surprised at all if the Dweeze bails in the next year or so.


I think I know what you mean but I'm not sure if I agree. Compared to the first year or two, ZPZ's demand has decreased 30%-50%. The three main reasons for this are that alumni aren't included in the line-up like they were the first couple of years, that they return to the same markets too often and the unfortunate economic crisis we're still enduring. And hence, why Dweezil recently needed to lay-off a few band members (a few "key" members, I might add). Hopefully, you're not right. I would hate to think that could happen. But I guess we'll have to wait and see...

Contrary to some opinions, there are "Other People" who are quite willing and capable to play this music.


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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 10:26 pm 
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KUIII wrote:
Disco Boy wrote:
Ronny's Noomies wrote:
I will not be surprised at all if the Dweeze bails in the next year or so.


I think I know what you mean but I'm not sure if I agree. Compared to the first year or two, ZPZ's demand has decreased 30%-50%. The three main reasons for this are that alumni aren't included in the line-up like they were the first couple of years, that they return to the same markets too often and the unfortunate economic crisis we're still enduring. And hence, why Dweezil recently needed to lay-off a few band members (a few "key" members, I might add). Hopefully, you're not right. I would hate to think that could happen. But I guess we'll have to wait and see...

Contrary to some opinions, there are "Other People" who are quite willing and capable to play this music.


Yes, I know. And I had to chance to see FZ's music performed by some of those "Other People" once in 2008. The GrandMothers Of Invention played the material well but I don't think they're better than ZPZ.

Anyway, I don't really see why you're bringing the "Other People" up since this is about ZPZ?

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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 2:28 pm 
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We are the other people
We are the other people
You're the other people too !

As much as I dislike dz, ZPZ replicates Frank best..... And Eddie Van Halen, but thats another story.

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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 3:32 pm 
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OBDULA X wrote:
We are the other people
We are the other people
You're the other people too !

As much as I dislike dz, ZPZ replicates Frank best..... And Eddie Van Halen, but thats another story.

I agree, Dweezil is a great replicant. I think Eddie Van Halen said that Dweezil sounded more like him than he did. Dweezil also mimics Franks superbly. Dweezil's is an excellent "cover" guitarist. Probably the best I've ever heard. I like it when people like Ed Palermo or the Ensemble Modern interpret Frank's material. That makes for a more interesting listening experience to me.


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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 3:49 pm 
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Here's what I was thinking. I was disappointed with this last tour. The performances were not up to the level of previous tours. The band is 2 lighter and didn't pick up the slack, imo. Then the Dweeze starts playing his own and others' songs on FZ's time so to speak, which tells me he might be wanting to go in other directions. I think he might be getting bored, or frustrated that his original grand plan isn't working as well as he'd hoped when he first got the idea to display Frank's music in live situations. He's been talking about working on his own music for a while now; perhaps he's about to do that.

ZPZ might be about running it's course.

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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 5:18 pm 
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The beginning of the end was when Ray left the band. Zpz plays nearly all the same songs every night. They just change the order. Not worth going more than once a tour, if that. Frank mixed it up more, every night. He certainly wouldn't play Whipping Post EVERY night. WTF, Eruption and Somebody Get Me a Doctor every night? Is it Dweezil Zappa plays the music of Frank Zappa and Eddie Van Halen ? No thanks. I did see ZPZ twice a tour for the first 3 or 4 years......I'm over it .....It's over Johnny, except for the download :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 3:15 pm 
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OBDULA X wrote:
The beginning of the end was when Ray left the band. Zpz plays nearly all the same songs every night. They just change the order. Not worth going more than once a tour, if that. Frank mixed it up more, every night. He certainly wouldn't play Whipping Post EVERY night. WTF, Eruption and Somebody Get Me a Doctor every night? Is it Dweezil Zappa plays the music of Frank Zappa and Eddie Van Halen ? No thanks. I did see ZPZ twice a tour for the first 3 or 4 years......I'm over it .....It's over Johnny, except for the download :mrgreen:

Yeah, I agree. I never bought into Ben knowing that there were real living people like NMB, Ray White, and Ike Willis who could do it better.


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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 4:19 pm 
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I think another reason Dweezil had to let a few people go is his fetish for the newest, bestest gear.


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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 6:57 pm 
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DZpZ new dates? What's wrong with the old dates? Hmmm? I liked them. :mrgreen:

KUIII,I love Ed Palermo's big band treatment of FZ's music.I remember the first time I heard that CD on the way to the MT.Bleu,Tahoe show.Totally satisfied me and great traveling music to drive too also.Thanx for the tip man! :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 11:18 pm 
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Pope Jim wrote:
I think another reason Dweezil had to let a few people go is his fetish for the newest, bestest gear.

Yeah, I get tired of Dweezil (and others) who obsess over their tone and gear. Just plug it in and play, man!


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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 3:13 pm 
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Hi,

I think that ZPZ is over.

I have never been so disappointed with a concert as I was when I saw this with Return to Forever in Eugene, Oregon, last year ... and in my book it was something that Frank would not have stood for and would have fired the band, Dweezil included!

If he wants to do this, he has to take a stand and save some of these "standards" for the encores and go after more challenging material ... and musicians ... because there are many that would gladly do some of this material for him, and with him ... like Jean Luc Ponty that even made a pointed comment in Eugene, about King Kong! Unffortunately, Dweezil is intimidated by musicians that are above his realm ... since he is just a note/chord player ... not an original.

All in all, I would like to see him take this band ... and he can even keep the name ... and this time say ... ZPZ plays Dweezil ... and do something else ... and show that he is much better than just a bored copykat rock guitar player ... that learned how to play through guitar hero instead of through pure love and enjoyment to what the music means to him personally. At that point, Dweezil will either stand up and shine, or simply die.

When listening to the material he played, I had the idea that Dweezil was afraid to let the musicians go and shine on their own, lest the "music" lost its focus, or it did not sound "faithful" and "original", which in the end tends to limit the musicians to playing the perfect note on the score ... and not have fun ... unless you are a hired hand playing every night somewhere else, you must know how to read music and sight read it easily ... and you had the feeling that all those folks were just sight reading and falling asleep with it. And I think that I would retire the old trusty Gibson and get your own guitar Dweezil!

I kinda want to do one of my directing fun things on his rehearsal ... throw kitchen sink, the vacuum cleaner, the screaming mother from hell, the trust screaming fans, and everything else ... and then Dewwzil ... you have ... the "Zappa Trust Blues and thing". Make sure you satirize all of us whiners and winos and lunatics here on this board ... and voila ... you got your lyrics ... I'll do the falsetto backwards!


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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 6:11 am 
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Moshkito wrote:
Hi,

I think that ZPZ is over.

I have never been so disappointed with a concert as I was when I saw this with Return to Forever in Eugene, Oregon, last year ... and in my book it was something that Frank would not have stood for and would have fired the band, Dweezil included!

If he wants to do this, he has to take a stand and save some of these "standards" for the encores and go after more challenging material ... and musicians ... because there are many that would gladly do some of this material for him, and with him ... like Jean Luc Ponty that even made a pointed comment in Eugene, about King Kong! Unffortunately, Dweezil is intimidated by musicians that are above his realm ... since he is just a note/chord player ... not an original.

All in all, I would like to see him take this band ... and he can even keep the name ... and this time say ... ZPZ plays Dweezil ... and do something else ... and show that he is much better than just a bored copykat rock guitar player ... that learned how to play through guitar hero instead of through pure love and enjoyment to what the music means to him personally. At that point, Dweezil will either stand up and shine, or simply die.

When listening to the material he played, I had the idea that Dweezil was afraid to let the musicians go and shine on their own, lest the "music" lost its focus, or it did not sound "faithful" and "original", which in the end tends to limit the musicians to playing the perfect note on the score ... and not have fun ... unless you are a hired hand playing every night somewhere else, you must know how to read music and sight read it easily ... and you had the feeling that all those folks were just sight reading and falling asleep with it. And I think that I would retire the old trusty Gibson and get your own guitar Dweezil!

I kinda want to do one of my directing fun things on his rehearsal ... throw kitchen sink, the vacuum cleaner, the screaming mother from hell, the trust screaming fans, and everything else ... and then Dewwzil ... you have ... the "Zappa Trust Blues and thing". Make sure you satirize all of us whiners and winos and lunatics here on this board ... and voila ... you got your lyrics ... I'll do the falsetto backwards!





I did not see them on the RTF tour but took unbiased observers who were unfamiliar with the music to the Apostrophe Tour and the Scott Thunes Tour, they were blown away by the quality and skill of the bands and my Heavy Metal guy who was in Sac for Thunes said it may have been the best live show he every saw and he has seen many concerts...You must have seen them on an off night all though the shows have varying performances, I can never say they were bad or even less than very good, the range is usually very good to phenomenal.

I do agree the last two rounds with Ray were the bar, but the last two rounds I saw were a very close second. The fact that key members are now gone does concern me, but Frank always seemed to manage with the same type of diversity. How anyone can financial question the Trust or DZ is just intellectually dishonest, the economic downturn has crossed all segments of society including entertainment (Diddy got rid of his jet) and has surely effected the trust as well a DZ.

As Yodi would say "Far too critical you be"...

:smoke:


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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 6:56 am 
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Plook wrote:
As Yodi would say "Far too critical you be"...

Do you mean Yoda or you just singing Yodi-lay-he-who? LOL!
Funny I may be? :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 12:44 pm 
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Anyway the wind blows; I'll continue to see ZPZ concerts.


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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 1:19 pm 
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coevad wrote:
Anyway the wind blows; I'll continue to see ZPZ concerts.

+1

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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 6:53 pm 
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I still think ZPZ is really impressive, especially to folks seeing them and maybe hearing this music performed live and well for the first time (or second or third time). As I've said before though, ZPZ has lost some of it's luster with me over the years. I was never a Ben fan. As long as NMB, Ray, and Ike are roaming the Earth I'll always know that there are people who can (and are) singing it much better. As Mosh said, Dweezil IS a copy cat guitarist - granted a VERY GOOD copy cat guitarist - and that's OK within the context of ZPZ. I mean he shouldn't be trying to sound like Santana or Jimmy Page in a Zappa Tribute Band. Now a lot of the original members are gone, replaced by lesser players imo (or not replaced at all - Billy is sorely missed). I hope Dweezil keeps it up if his heart is still in it but if this is what he's going to float out there now he's going to have to play in smaller venues and charge less for tickets (not necessarily a bad thing). I would go see ZPZ now if they came to a local club for $25.00 or less but that's about it.


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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 11:15 am 
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blsabob23 wrote:
Hoping for some dates in the Colorado, New Mexico, Arizona region this fall, as I was unable to make the recent Tucson show. If you are going to hit New Mexico again, I suggest finding a venue other than the Sunshine Theater. The acoustics there are horrific. Try the Kimo, the Kiva, or the Santa Fe Sol.

It's the Sunshine.....just get front row and the poor venue sound won't matter!


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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 3:05 pm 
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viewtopic.php?f=7&t=23689

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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 7:36 pm 
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Oh well, the Sunshine it is then. I'm not going to look a gift horse in the mouth as we get so few really good shows here in Albuquerque. And while I am a bit disappointed with the truncated band and concerned with what will probably be a thinner sound, I imagine that ZPZ will still deliver a better show than 95% of the rest of the bands on the market today. I'm not going to cry over spilled milk and compare the current ZPZ to what I was fortunate enough to see in 2006 and 2007. I'm just going to be thankful that there is still an amazing group of musicians playing the songs of one of my alltime favorite composers/performers, and that they will be playing a a show 10 minutes from my house.

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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 8:51 pm 
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blsabob23 wrote:
Oh well, the Sunshine it is then. I'm not going to look a gift horse in the mouth as we get so few really good shows here in Albuquerque. And while I am a bit disappointed with the truncated band and concerned with what will probably be a thinner sound, I imagine that ZPZ will still deliver a better show than 95% of the rest of the bands on the market today. I'm not going to cry over spilled milk and compare the current ZPZ to what I was fortunate enough to see in 2006 and 2007. I'm just going to be thankful that there is still an amazing group of musicians playing the songs of one of my alltime favorite composers/performers, and that they will be playing a a show 10 minutes from my house.

Relax,you'll love it,trust me. :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:38 am 
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E-mail from Zappa.com:

Hello Friends and fellow music enthusiasts lurking about,

I hope you don't mind me reaching out to you about some exciting news. I wanted to share a few things with you about our upcoming Zappa Plays Zappa tour as well as a new collection of songs from the FOH series that will be available in time for the tour and for Christmas.

First the tour! We are off to the UK and Europe in November and will be packing our rocking teenage combo gear carefully so that we can be sure to give it everything we've got out there on the stage. I am very excited about the new material we will be playing and the new guitar sounds I have created. More on the tunes a bit later...

As for the US in December, there are a number of fans we've heard from over the years who have asked if we could come closer to them so they don't have to travel as far from their self-described "geographically challenged" locations. (Incidentally I heard that a lot from folks in Wales in the UK and we're going there too) We are excited about the opportunity to come play in some of these legendary locations for the first time ever. We'll be migratory minstrels hoping to entice the locals to join us for a great night of music in Fargo ND, Council Bluffs IA, Boise ID, and Missoula Montana! (complete tour dates can be found here: http://www.dweezilzappaworld.com/events and http://zappaplayszappa.com/tourdates.html)

Playing "Montana" in Montana will be a surreal moment for us... how about you? Be sure to floss!

I bet you might be asking yourself what else might ZPZ be playing that will make this tour different from the other tours? Well my answer to you is, Zappa Plays Zappa will be playing a show that could be best described as a decades show. We are playing a selection of material from 3 different decades, 60s, 70s, 80s, and we will be premiering some more new material we have never performed before including an orchestral piece that I have wanted to play since I started this project in 2006. Think 200 Motels... Besides that there are a few nice surprises we'll be throwing in from some of my favorite FZ records.

I always endeavor to balance the show with fan favorites as well as make room for some of your potential new favorites you might not have heard yet. I hope to see you out on the road in November and December!

On to new music that will be available! Besides the exciting new availability of the Frank Zappa catalog we are pleased to announce the new Zappa Plays Zappa FOH series recording called "Out Of Obscurity". It features a selection of performances from the February 2011 tour. (For complete info on the FOH series: http://www.dweezilzappaworld.com/pages/ ... -very-soon) Scott Thunes is performing on bass. The majority of the songs were premiere songs on that tour and many were exclusive to that tour.

The intimate sound of the record almost puts you, the listener, on stage with us. With a large percentage of songs selected from the first few Frank Zappa and the Mothers Of Invention records there is a distinctly different feel to this collection of songs. I'm pleased to hear the musical growth and development within the band as well. I hope you enjoy the CD and I look forward to seeing you all out on tour.

Regards, DZ

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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:34 pm 
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It was the Scott Thunes Feb.2012 tour and not a mythical Scott Thunes 2011 Feb. tour as DZ states,that should be on his next FOH-CD.

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 Post subject: Re: new ZPZ dates
PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2012 5:07 pm 
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I too sense that ZPZ may be in its waning period, at least in its original conception.

That original conception, frankly, is the biggest limiting factor. Dweezil (and Gail) took the concept of FZ's music as fixed compositions way too seriously. As everyone here knows, FZ modified the arrangements and even basic compositional elements with each successive tour. There were also usually elements of FZ shows that were one-time only events.

Dweezil placed too many limits on himself and his band by making them adhere so rigidly to a given FZ recording as the "definitive" version of that song. That was more than acceptable on the first tour as a starting point, but there was no room for the project to grow. Dweezil decided to focus on FZ's '70s music primarily, and there's really only so much of that to be played. Arrangements could be changed and freshened up if done so in a respectful manner. "Billy The Mountain" could (should) have been performed with updated and continuously changing cultural references, rather than slavishly adhering to the specific things that Flo and Eddie ad-libbed on that one particular night in 1971 that happened to be professionally recorded.

The last ZPZ tour, where Dweezil did the Van Halen schtick and spent way too much time talking, was the low point of the project for me. I had greatly enjoyed every tour before that, but the 'storyteller' theme just made the show drag. I too think it's obvious that Dweezil's attention is starting to move away from ZPZ. It's noticeable in how his guitar playing in ZPZ has started to drift away from Frank's style and into Dweezil's metal stylings. Personally, I see that as an encouraging sign. Maybe he'll take ZPZ into some new places, even if it's still with FZ's repertoire. He almost has to do that, being without a percussionist or second guitarist.


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