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 Post subject: Nothing is New anymore
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:13 am 
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Two posts in another thread struck a chord with me. Rather than derail that thread I am starting this one. You can either analyze or add lost memories. I don't usually start threads and I am not sure where this one will lead, or not, but it's a real epiphany to me. ymmv.

Imagine digging thru the bins at the local discount store in 1970 looking for the latest Mothers release after Uncle Meat and finding Hot Rats under 'Z'. WTF? Why is Zappa not with the Mothers? What kind of cover is this? What happend???
When the opening to 'Peaches' blasted from my speakers I found a new Zappa. Until that moment Frank was just a member of the Mothers, a band that called out life's absurdities and people's shortcomings. By the time Camel was over I was in shock. This was New and Exciting. Hot Rats was my reference for Musical Excellence from that moment on. My record collection ran from Beatles on the left, Mothers in the middle, and Zappa on the end holding them all up. I still spin Hot Rats a couple of times a year and never tire of it.
Today that would not have happened. We would have had advance notice that Frank was doing a solo album outside the Mothers and it would be a fusion of Jazz and Rock. We would have had months to argue the merits and shortcomings of such an effort and bitched about the end of the Mothers and who the hell does HE think HE is. By the time we get to hear this new music we would have already formed opinions of the styles and sound and probably heard some of the album on the internet. We would already be discussing the next album as if this was just another piece coming off the assembly line.
My point is: The element of surprise is gone. Nothing is new anymore. God I miss those days....


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:56 am 
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Starting around 1971, every Saturday morning was "do the record store rounds" time. Rarely knew what would be out. The fun was in the looking. Best part --- the import bins! It was also handy that by going every week, the store clerks got to know me, and would let me know if something I might like (or not like) was out. Plus, being a regular meant freebies and discounts!!

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 9:04 am 
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just plain doug wrote:
Starting around 1971, every Saturday morning was "do the record store rounds" time. Rarely knew what would be out. The fun was in the looking. Best part --- the import bins! It was also handy that by going every week, the store clerks got to know me, and would let me know if something I might like (or not like) was out. Plus, being a regular meant freebies and discounts!!


I used to do weekly record store runs as well pre-internet. It was fun stuff, and thankfully there are a couple of decent independent stores around now if I get the jones to randomly browse.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 10:17 am 
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Ruz-El wrote:
just plain doug wrote:
Starting around 1971, every Saturday morning was "do the record store rounds" time. Rarely knew what would be out. The fun was in the looking. Best part --- the import bins! It was also handy that by going every week, the store clerks got to know me, and would let me know if something I might like (or not like) was out. Plus, being a regular meant freebies and discounts!!


I used to do weekly record store runs as well pre-internet. It was fun stuff, and thankfully there are a couple of decent independent stores around now if I get the jones to randomly browse.

It was all right walking in a shop but is that the meaning of this thread or is it more like the saying Money For Old Rope :idea:

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 11:09 am 
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Oh guys, shall I tell you how it was like - living in the East, behind the wall, and only being able to get to know Wish You Were Here as promptly as 8 years after its release in the western lands, at the earliest -- as an east german LP configuration that Roger Waters is never going to get one Penny of royalties for, I bet ?!?


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 11:21 am 
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Being from former West Germany, in 1982 I had to do work at the Leipzig fair in East Germany. We didn't stay at a hotel but with a family that rented a room to people who had to work at the fair. The guy soon found out that I was into music and played me an AMIGA pressing of Isao Tomita's Pictures At An Exhibition, which was the one and only album he had. On the day of our departure he gave the album to me as as gift. Only much later I realized how much this album must have meant to him and what an honour it really was to receive it from him as a gift. I still have this album and now and then play it, usually together with Francesco, which is a good combination for dining pleasures around Christmas time.

Just wanted to tell this story, because today people like us can have everything at any time. We can make choices. That wasn't always the case, and it still isn't for many people. This may be my message for the holidays, or what?

Th.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 1:50 am 
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F.Natural wrote:
Two posts in another thread struck a chord with me. Rather than derail that thread I am starting this one. You can either analyze or add lost memories. I don't usually start threads and I am not sure where this one will lead, or not, but it's a real epiphany to me. ymmv.

Imagine digging thru the bins at the local discount store in 1970 looking for the latest Mothers release after Uncle Meat and finding Hot Rats under 'Z'. WTF? Why is Zappa not with the Mothers? What kind of cover is this? What happend???
When the opening to 'Peaches' blasted from my speakers I found a new Zappa. Until that moment Frank was just a member of the Mothers, a band that called out life's absurdities and people's shortcomings. By the time Camel was over I was in shock. This was New and Exciting. Hot Rats was my reference for Musical Excellence from that moment on. My record collection ran from Beatles on the left, Mothers in the middle, and Zappa on the end holding them all up. I still spin Hot Rats a couple of times a year and never tire of it.
Today that would not have happened. We would have had advance notice that Frank was doing a solo album outside the Mothers and it would be a fusion of Jazz and Rock. We would have had months to argue the merits and shortcomings of such an effort and bitched about the end of the Mothers and who the hell does HE think HE is. By the time we get to hear this new music we would have already formed opinions of the styles and sound and probably heard some of the album on the internet. We would already be discussing the next album as if this was just another piece coming off the assembly line.
My point is: The element of surprise is gone. Nothing is new anymore. God I miss those days....


Zappa said the world was likely to end in paperwork or nostalgia, but who cares.

You're right, the element of surprise has gone, and it's the internet which has stopped it. In summary the internet is shit. :lol:


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 2:53 am 
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I see we are here from both sides of the the iron curtain - I'm from Hungary, remembering of course the days when most of our music was stored (and known from) copied casettes, the albums mostly in cheesy Yugoslavian pressing, and it was only our lucky or extremely rich friends who had the albums in german pressing (or from the USA!...).

In spite of this I do not feel what you say above, and I do not blame the internet. It's not (only) that the world changed, but we became more lazy. In the old times we didn't stay home to wait for the surprise, but went after it, seeking shops, talking to friends, going abroad, etc. The thing is that even now, these days i do have surprises, too: mostly when I go to see a concert, when I go to a festival and inevitably see/hear new bands, but it also happens on TV or on the internet: I meet lots of great bands, hear great new music there. (It was just yesterday that with friends we gave a little "concert" where we work - it was fun, with lots of chat about music: with tiny, but some surpises and new discoveries.) So I don't miss anything, I am glad to have now this or that album (from a student of mine I got Hot Rats vinyl as a present some time ago!...), I am glad last year I saw Roger Waters, etc etc....

Of course nothing is as it was, but that's the nature of things - and thinking that "everything" or "most of the surprise" or whatever "is lost", is too depressive - and untrue - to me. So my advice: go out, see shows, talk about music with friends! With or without the mighty internet. If you stay home, doing nothing, waiting for something... nothing will happen. :-)


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 4:59 am 
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Nothing is new anymore?

Maybe you just felt it all was new ,'cause you were younger?

I've found that if you are searching for "new" as in new angles on music,......well, you'd better look in the underground. Self released music,I mean. The record companies (Big ones) have such a hold on what they think is going to sell that they couldn't really be bothered to "take a chance" on new ,hybrid music from people who are only making music for themselves(like Frank did....even if they are a different genre').

So, check out sites like Wayside music from Maryland USA,or Eclipse-Records from the US midwest,.....and for heavier sounds Lasers Edge music or Aquarius Records.org. There's loads to still explore.....it's just NOT in you local stores. Have fun!


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 5:30 am 
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Very True

People complaining that there's no good music anymore just need to look a little deeper. I second the above mentioned sites. I also know that I like to explore traditional music from other countries, especially the Middle East. I went through a Turkish Sufi music phase recently. I'm a sucker for anything featuring a oud or a ney flute.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 11:07 am 
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Now thinking about it a bit more... to me it seems that in the last 20 years there are more new things than it was before. In the "internet-age..." I got to know the Information INK homepage with tons of exciting infos. I met (on the net and in person) the guys behind Kill Ugly Radio, I've seen and heard quite a few FZ-tribute bands, I was lucky to get in contact with David Ocker: I've informed him about a symphonic FZ-concert (Gail finally didn' ban it), and he wrote me his thoughts on it; I've found some pages that helped me how to play this or that tune on guitar - etc etc. I was extatic in the early 2000s when I've found hundreds of shows to download and discuss and listen to... It's just amazing what a big work this web-community made on FZs huge body of work: sharing shows, collecting infos, reviewing shows, reviewing albums, etc (most of the times anonimously, for free, for everybody).

If we keep on thinking about "album-sleeves" or "original releases" or "not being the same", we surely will be disappointed. If we focus on music (what else?...), we might constantly find new and new surprises.

My surprises from nowadays are when 1.) I try to play one of the songs and realize how the structure works, and 2.) when I listen to the LSO recordings - which I do quite often nowadays -, find new discoveries each day: connection between Wazoo, FZ's solos, the synclavier works... and the music in itself is beautiful, too.

Try it! :-)


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 3:55 am 
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Nothing to add that others haven't already said but interesting thread F.Natural

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 8:48 am 
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Location: Pouting for you? Punky Meadows, pouting for you?!!
Is this anything to do with my having said that I may know too much about Finer Moments before getting it? Don't worry, I have this affliction that won't allow me to accept anything until it's actually right in front of me. Opening Finer Moments and playing it was a huge buzz for me. I love it. The bizarre band improvs, the electronic stuff and particularly the guitar tracks are right up my alley. FZ seemed to be too cagey to release much of his solo work with the early Mothers. Without knowing this was the one, I've been waiting for this album for 30 years - it's a gem.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:21 am 
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Location: back east...
Nope. I just came to the realization that the mass communicatons and marketing strategies that resulted from modern technologies lessens the impact of new releases from artists.
By the time I get the new LP, CD, or whatever in my hands I've read about the artists involved, where it was recorded, what it "sounds like", etc. Preconceptions formed by the advance knowledge colors the initial listening session so much that it's not so much a surprise anymore but as if I've already heard the music.
As for the non-mainstream music. I just don't enjoy the musical styles currently promoted. But that's a whole 'nother thread.


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