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PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 8:33 pm 
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OBDULA X wrote:
Frank was an original. dweezil covers an original. I'm not paying close to $150 to see Any cover band. I saw Frank 13 times,I might have paid a little more than $150 total for those shows. 1980-88. Greedy Bastards. That's mostly what it is. Greedy cocksuckers.

I also am not going to overpay in NYC so dz can play in Billings for $30


No matter how clear chumcloud and I have been, you're NEVER going to understand how it works, are you?

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 10:41 pm 
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jpd & my '84 tix were canadian dollars, which was closer to the average usa '84 price of $13.00 usd

fz shows in nyc from tcm
$20.00 in '88 ~ $38.22 in 2012
$18.00 in '84 ~ $39.16 "
$13.50 in '81 ~ $33.58 "
$10.50 in '80 ~ $28.80 "
$8.50 in '78 ~ $29.51 "
$8.00 in '76 ~ $31.83 "
$7.50 in '75 ~ $31.57 "


a frank zappa nyc show would cost $30 to $40 today if inflation was the only chicken to measure by; frank never went for that meet 'n greet fleece 'em some more shit except for some classical concerts, and he would donate the vip skim back to the orchestra

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 12:46 pm 
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slime.oofytv.set wrote:
jpd & my '84 tix were canadian dollars, which was closer to the average usa '84 price of $13.00 usd

fz shows in nyc from tcm
$20.00 in '88 ~ $38.22 in 2012
$18.00 in '84 ~ $39.16 "
$13.50 in '81 ~ $33.58 "
$10.50 in '80 ~ $28.80 "
$8.50 in '78 ~ $29.51 "
$8.00 in '76 ~ $31.83 "
$7.50 in '75 ~ $31.57 "


a frank zappa nyc show would cost $30 to $40 today if inflation was the only chicken to measure by; frank never went for that meet 'n greet fleece 'em some more shit except for some classical concerts, and he would donate the vip skim back to the orchestra



Actually that inflation index isn't so acurate $20.00 in say '84 was more like $100 today, you have to be a little more comparative than that simply inflation and $7.50 in '75 was top dollar most big shows were $5...That "80, 84, or '88 show would be $100 today... :smoke:


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 4:34 pm 
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slime.oofytv.set wrote:
jpd & my '84 tix were canadian dollars, which was closer to the average usa '84 price of $13.00 usd

fz shows in nyc from tcm
$20.00 in '88 ~ $38.22 in 2012
$18.00 in '84 ~ $39.16 "
$13.50 in '81 ~ $33.58 "
$10.50 in '80 ~ $28.80 "
$8.50 in '78 ~ $29.51 "
$8.00 in '76 ~ $31.83 "
$7.50 in '75 ~ $31.57 "


a frank zappa nyc show would cost $30 to $40 today if inflation was the only chicken to measure by; frank never went for that meet 'n greet fleece 'em some more shit except for some classical concerts, and he would donate the vip skim back to the orchestra


Right...but unfortunately, it isn't the only chicken to measure by...

Plook wrote:
Actually that inflation index isn't so acurate $20.00 in say '84 was more like $100 today, you have to be a little more comparative than that simply inflation and $7.50 in '75 was top dollar most big shows were $5...That "80, 84, or '88 show would be $100 today... :smoke:


slime's inflation estimations are about as accurate as can be...

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 1:18 pm 
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Disco Boy wrote:
slime.oofytv.set wrote:
jpd & my '84 tix were canadian dollars, which was closer to the average usa '84 price of $13.00 usd

fz shows in nyc from tcm
$20.00 in '88 ~ $38.22 in 2012
$18.00 in '84 ~ $39.16 "
$13.50 in '81 ~ $33.58 "
$10.50 in '80 ~ $28.80 "
$8.50 in '78 ~ $29.51 "
$8.00 in '76 ~ $31.83 "
$7.50 in '75 ~ $31.57 "


a frank zappa nyc show would cost $30 to $40 today if inflation was the only chicken to measure by; frank never went for that meet 'n greet fleece 'em some more shit except for some classical concerts, and he would donate the vip skim back to the orchestra


Right...but unfortunately, it isn't the only chicken to measure by...

Plook wrote:
Actually that inflation index isn't so acurate $20.00 in say '84 was more like $100 today, you have to be a little more comparative than that simply inflation and $7.50 in '75 was top dollar most big shows were $5...That "80, 84, or '88 show would be $100 today... :smoke:


slime's inflation estimations are about as accurate as can be...


That is for Frank ! The dweez is not a $150 concert

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 4:02 pm 
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I still say $20 dollars in '80 was more like $100 today...sorry just my opinion... :smoke:


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 6:21 pm 
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Plook. How much did Tinseltown Rebellion cost on vinyl in '80? And how much more was the concert ticket? Is it equal to the price difference between a DZ cd and his concert ticket today?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:31 pm 
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OBDULA X wrote:
That is for Frank ! The dweez is not a $150 concert


ONCE AGAIN, it is if enough people decide to pay that price to see ZPZ...

Plook wrote:
I still say $20 dollars in '80 was more like $100 today...sorry just my opinion... :smoke:


But that's not true. $20 in 1980 would equal over $56 today.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 7:14 am 
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downer mydnyte wrote:
Plook. How much did Tinseltown Rebellion cost on vinyl in '80? And how much more was the concert ticket? Is it equal to the price difference between a DZ cd and his concert ticket today?



I would say for new CD they are more expensive than the albums were back then by about 40%, although if you go the used CD store route you are probably paying 50% less than you would buy albums for.

I think a lot of concerts for big acts are at least 30% more than back then and the so called mega groups are rediculous, maybe 300% higher. I know we are comparing apples and oranges but DZ when out side a major market is cheaper than his dad by about 20% to 30 %, but when inside a major market and/or doing some type of special offer he can be as much as 30% higher.

Just my O-pine... :smoke:


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 3:12 am 
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ok, in addition to the Halloween show, Pollstar is listing an additional ZPZ show on Sun 10/13 at the Beacon. What the hell is up with that? :?

http://www.pollstar.com/resultsArtist.aspx?ID=483

and BTW, nothing on the beacon website


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 3:49 am 
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thats a mistake.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 3:57 am 
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chumcloud wrote:
thats a mistake.

yup, it's gotta be


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:28 am 
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downer mydnyte wrote:
How much did Tinseltown Rebellion cost on vinyl in '80? And how much more was the concert ticket?

It was priceless :wink: Didn't appear until '81... I know, since I spent the last half of 1980 waiting in vain for Crush All Boxes. The only new Zappa record in 1980 was IDWG Drafted/Ancient Armaments 45 on 7 and 12 inch vinyl. On the other hand I got to see him live in Drammenshallen that spring. Can't remember exactly what the ticket cost. But in Norway a concert ticket and a double album would be about the same, as I recall - perhaps slightly more for the concert. About 100-150 NKR ($15-$20). Standard price for a CD today is about the same - cheaper, considering inflation in general.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:08 am 
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cozylittlefooties wrote:
ok, in addition to the Halloween show, Pollstar is listing an additional ZPZ show on Sun 10/13 at the Beacon. What the hell is up with that? :?

http://www.pollstar.com/resultsArtist.aspx?ID=483

and BTW, nothing on the beacon website


I sent them an email and sure 'nuff, they took it down


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 7:31 pm 
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DC Boogie wrote:
I got to see him live in Drammenshallen that spring.


Cool!


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 10:31 pm 
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n'obdulla x wrote:
That is for Frank ! The dweez is not a $150 concert
Image : a frank zappa nyc show would cost $30 to $40 today ... wrote:


any show at any venue in nyc on oct-31 gets a 25-50% whack over a non-halloween show, the dweez can easily sell out 1 halloween show in nyc at $150 a pop ... in the unlikely event frank was playing a nyc show on halloween oct-31-2013, also assume it's been at least 5 years since the last frank zappa tour, probably a mini reunion covering 4 or 5 cities, with plenty of alumni, ruth, vinnie, vai, george, mark 'n howie, tommy etc ... how much for the [virtual] tix ¿

$650 ¿
$900 ¿
€ 1500 ¿

or more ¿

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:17 am 
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The Beacon Halloween show will sell out, as it should. If I could go, I would have already bought a ticket. Saw them at a smallish venue in my hometown last year, and even without alumni and a smaller band, they still killed it. I paid about $85 for the pre-show meet and greet soundcheck, and was worth every penny. The concert itself was very close to sold out.

In '88, I paid $17.50 for Royal Oak and $20 for the Muskegon Zappa shows. Also worth every penny. I believe at least two of the three Royal Oak shows sold out, but definitely not Fruenthal.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 7:59 pm 
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slime.oofytv.set wrote:
any show at any venue in nyc on oct-31 gets a 25-50% whack over a non-halloween show, the dweez can easily sell out 1 halloween show in nyc at $150 a pop...


Not necessarily.

Before the questions can be answered accurately, it depends on the draw of the artist or ZPZ, the amount of times or how recently they've already played the market(s) in question, the size of the venue and a few other important factors.

More specifics are needed...

slime.oofytv.set wrote:
in the unlikely event frank was playing a nyc show on halloween oct-31-2013, also assume it's been at least 5 years since the last frank zappa tour, probably a mini reunion covering 4 or 5 cities, with plenty of alumni, ruth, vinnie, vai, george, mark 'n howie, tommy etc ... how much for the [virtual] tix ¿

$650 ¿
$900 ¿
€ 1500 ¿

or more ¿


Well, similar to the above, despite the fact you've narrowed the criteria, we'd still need to know venue sizes and if the shows were weekday or weekend shows, etc., before the question can be accurately answered.

But I'll have a go at it, anyway...

Considering it would only be 5 cities, with each being weekend shows (numbers rounded to the nearest hundred thousandth/hundredth/dollar):

City/Venue/Gross/Capacity/Attendance/Average Ticket Price/

LA ~ Wiltern Theater ($225,000/2,300/Sold Out/$98)
NYC ~ Theater @ Madison Square Garden ($575,000/5,600/Sold Out/$103)
Boston ~ Orpheum Theater ($300,000/2,800/Sold Out/$107)
Paris ~ Le Grand Rex ($350,000/2,800/Sold Out/$125)
London ~ Hammersmith Apollo ($375,000/3,600/Sold Out/$104)

Also, the considering the average ticket prices, the scaling of prices would be between $50-$150 (with possibly limited quantities of VIP/Meet & Greet packages in the $300-$500 range).

And lastly, the above 5 markets would draw from markets that are anywhere from 0-8 hours driving distance away (meaning 10%-50% of that market's draw would travel). More specifically, LA would draw from the rest of CA, NV & AZ, NYC from the rest of NY, NJ, MD, DC, PA, OH and even Ontario, Boston from the rest of New England and Quebec, Paris from the rest of France, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Belgium, Germany, Switzerland & Northern Italy and London from the rest of the England, Ireland & UK...

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 1:22 pm 
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disco boy wrote:
... considering the average ticket prices, the scaling of prices would be between $50-$150 (with possibly limited quantities of VIP/Meet & Greet packages in the $300-$500 range).
...Paris from the rest of France, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Belgium, Germany...

at the virtual age of 70-something, virtual fz's motivation for a world tour would be next to zero, no euroshows, no meet-my-meat vip tix, no downloads, no guitar raffles, 2-weeks/3-weekends, cash only tix on sale day of show:

la-wiltern [$520k/ 2,300 / $225]
sf-orpheum [$450k / 2,250 / $200]
chicago-op.house [$720k / 3,600 / $200]
nyc-msg oct-31 [$1.5m / 5,600 / $275]
boston-orpheum [$720k / 3,600 / $200]

~ $4 million hardcore capitalist us dollars plus enough material for a couple of double albums ... @ 30 bucks per freak for a t-shirt or some other piece of swag or merch, add another ~ $½ mil [cash only] to cover rentals, per diems, band expenses, preserved minnows, pojamas, etc.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 9:36 pm 
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slime.oofytv.set wrote:
disco boy wrote:
... considering the average ticket prices, the scaling of prices would be between $50-$150 (with possibly limited quantities of VIP/Meet & Greet packages in the $300-$500 range).
...Paris from the rest of France, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Belgium, Germany...

at the virtual age of 70-something, virtual fz's motivation for a world tour would be next to zero, no euroshows, no meet-my-meat vip tix, no downloads, no guitar raffles, 2-weeks/3-weekends, cash only tix on sale day of show:

la-wiltern [$520k/ 2,300 / $225]
sf-orpheum [$450k / 2,250 / $200]
chicago-op.house [$720k / 3,600 / $200]
nyc-msg oct-31 [$1.5m / 5,600 / $275]
boston-orpheum [$720k / 3,600 / $200]

~ $4 million hardcore capitalist us dollars plus enough material for a couple of double albums ... @ 30 bucks per freak for a t-shirt or some other piece of swag or merch, add another ~ $½ mil [cash only] to cover rentals, per diems, band expenses, preserved minnows, pojamas, etc.


I deeply admire the effort...but there's no way in hell FZ could draw gross figures like that in those or in almost any regions. This is because, in most markets, his concert demand peaked in 1980. And in a handful of other markets, it peaked in the mid-'70s and mid-'80s. And my "virtual" FZ tour list reflects that. However, if FZ's concert demand had continued to increase everywhere throughout the '80s and beyond, you'd be much closer to being correct...

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:12 am 
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All I am saying is, and I'm sure most will agree, is that most of the concerts out there are way overpriced. Especially this one.
While not a fan, look at the bs Kid Rock has gone through to try and have a $20 ticket price. Once again, while not a fan, the fucker isn't greedy ! I guess you can make money off a $20 ticket.
http://www.travelerstoday.com/articles/ ... prices.htm

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 11:55 am 
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Everyone in the music industry knows you can make a modest living without jacking up ticket prices. Thing is, they have chosen to be in cahoots with the major corporations. They have to make a big profit. Most of these boring old farts are in it to make as much money as they possibly can.

If Dweezil wasn't in it for the money he'd be playing original material. Right? He'd be in it for the music. When you're in it for the music you create new music.

I'm not criticizing him for being in it for the money. It makes a lot of sense. Just don't try to tell me he's contributing anything to music. That is, unless a watered down version of something that was once vital and awesome in it's original form is considered a contribution to music.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 12:11 pm 
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Ya all can have your opinion, but I have seen ZPZ in all its forms and including the current 6 piece I saw in Madison...I am sorry but in some cases as good as FZ live... :smoke:

He is doing something for the music, keeping it alive and fresh, maybe you just need to see them again... :idea:

They have had peeks and valleys as everyone does. The first Tour while excellent it was a new band and DZ was still learning, the last tour with Ray was epic, and now that Ben has come into his own as front man and they have added the variety show aspect it is excellent again... 8)


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 12:20 pm 
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Plook wrote:
He is doing something for the music, keeping it alive

For a profit.
Like a coma victim.


They should call the band Hospice.


:mrgreen:


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 5:07 pm 
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OBDULA X wrote:
All I am saying is, and I'm sure most will agree, is that most of the concerts out there are way overpriced. Especially this one.
While not a fan, look at the bs Kid Rock has gone through to try and have a $20 ticket price. Once again, while not a fan, the fucker isn't greedy ! I guess you can make money off a $20 ticket.
http://www.travelerstoday.com/articles/ ... prices.htm


Both of you points are not correct.

First of all, most concerts are NOT over-priced and for reasons I've been over COUNTLESS TIMES in this thread and elsewhere.

Secondly, Kid Rock is NOT a large draw in most markets. Also, there's about 1,000 tix per show that are being sold for 10x or more to compensate for the cheaper $20 tix...

downer mydnyte wrote:
Everyone in the music industry knows you can make a modest living without jacking up ticket prices. Thing is, they have chosen to be in cahoots with the major corporations. They have to make a big profit. Most of these boring old farts are in it to make as much money as they possibly can.

If Dweezil wasn't in it for the money he'd be playing original material. Right? He'd be in it for the music. When you're in it for the music you create new music.

I'm not criticizing him for being in it for the money. It makes a lot of sense. Just don't try to tell me he's contributing anything to music. That is, unless a watered down version of something that was once vital and awesome in it's original form is considered a contribution to music.


downer mydnyte wrote:
Plook wrote:
He is doing something for the music, keeping it alive

For a profit.
Like a coma victim.


They should call the band Hospice.


:mrgreen:


You couldn't be more wrong if you tried...

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