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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 2:27 am 
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KUIII wrote:
calvin2hikers wrote:
The world is his oyster. He's talented enough to pull any career off!

Dweezil, if you put your mind to it you can do anything you want. You could even be the President of the United States.


Dang, that would be so awesome! Think of all the non-charisma people he could represent!

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 11:24 am 
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Ronny's Noomies wrote:
Dweezil isn't a composer. If he were, he would be doing it. True composers or song writers have brains that automatically and continually spew forth musical ideas and the urge to document them. They can't help it. It's just a matter of reaching out and plucking them from the stream. Dweezil's a player, not a writer.


Odd, your definition of "composer", when it comes to the profession it's someone who writes music. And Dweezil has written some pretty good music. When it's about "what comes from the heart, the body, the toes and the mind, what oozes out incessantly, even Hans Brinker couldn't stop the flow"... well, maybe he's not, but a lot of people aren't anything if that would be the only qualification.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 1:48 pm 
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I guess I'm thinking of one kind of composer, the one who is driven to write music and has neverending ideas. Examples from the rock world (not making any judgement on the quality of their music, but the ability to write at will): FZ, Paul McCartney, Bob Dylan, Ian Anderson, Stevie Wonder, Mike Keneally..... I guess I don't put Dweezil in that category because he always says he wants to get working on his own stuff, and my feeling is that if he had that kind of drive, he'd simply be doing it, not planning to get to it someday.

There are probably many kinds of composers. Maybe some write brilliant music but have to really work at it, not just be brimming with ideas. Oz Noy says he writes "when it's time to make an album." Jeff Beck collects snippets he likes and tries to put them together in the studio. Some can lay a song out full blown, while others take ages to get everything just right.

We're all spoiled by Frank.

One thing for certain is that I probably don't know what I'm talking about. :mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 1:55 pm 
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Ronny's Noomies wrote:
One thing for certain is that I probably don't know what I'm talking about. :mrgreen:



Agreed... :mrgreen:

Zzziiinnnggg... :!:



I'm sorry saw that laying on the ground and I couldn't resist picking it up and running with it... :smoke:


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 5:23 pm 
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You can't immerse yourself in playing someone else's music for years and years and then just pop right back and be original. Not possible. Your identity has been submerged. It's going to take a long while before you find your own voice. You've gotta nurture your own vision, right? You can't get away with neglecting it or being a clone.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 6:03 pm 
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downer mydnyte wrote:
You can't immerse yourself in playing someone else's music for years and years and then just pop right back and be original. Not possible. Your identity has been submerged. It's going to take a long while before you find your own voice. You've gotta nurture your own vision, right? You can't get away with neglecting it or being a clone.

Good point!

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 6:10 pm 
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Plook wrote:
Ronny's Noomies wrote:
One thing for certain is that I probably don't know what I'm talking about. :mrgreen:



Agreed... :mrgreen:

Zzziiinnnggg... :!:



I'm sorry saw that laying on the ground and I couldn't resist picking it up and running with it... :smoke:


I gotta learn that when you leave one high and over the plate, it's gone. :)

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 12:08 am 
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Ronny's Noomies wrote:
I gotta learn that when you leave one high and over the plate, it's gone. :)

Stoner munchies rule #31: You leave one high over the plate and whatever is served up, if eatable, is gone. Nyuk, nyuk, nyuk. :)

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 Post subject: Re: dweezil zappa
PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 8:12 pm 
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Lumpy Gravy wrote:
ok, so dweezil is not the great composer his dad was. so what?

I think we should give dweezil a break. not one of us can even begin to imagine what it's like to be the son (or daughter) of someone like frank zappa.

I have to admit that I haven't bought any of the zappa plays zappa-cds or dvds, but I still think dweezil is doing a great job in keeping frank zappa's legacy alive*.

being the son of frank and still have the courage to embark on such a venture is impressive and worth all the encouragement it can get.

*I saw zpz in philadelphia 2006, and it was great.
Well said :!: Dweezil is on a mission to retrieve the time lost when his dad was away from home and communicate with Frank in a parallel univers cuz music is the best for that!! :)

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 12:26 am 
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downer mydnyte wrote:
You can't immerse yourself in playing someone else's music for years and years and then just pop right back and be original. Not possible. Your identity has been submerged. It's going to take a long while before you find your own voice. You've gotta nurture your own vision, right? You can't get away with neglecting it or being a clone.

Music is not Rocket science you said a week ago,then post this Dribble :D

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 1:21 am 
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Mr_Green_Genes wrote:
Can he really play this backwards?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=skMZyT7-SdE

The youtube account with this video has been removed. :(

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 Post subject: Re: dweezil zappa
PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 1:37 am 
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ZutboF wrote:
Lumpy Gravy wrote:
ok, so dweezil is not the great composer his dad was. so what?

I think we should give dweezil a break. not one of us can even begin to imagine what it's like to be the son (or daughter) of someone like frank zappa.

I have to admit that I haven't bought any of the zappa plays zappa-cds or dvds, but I still think dweezil is doing a great job in keeping frank zappa's legacy alive*.

being the son of frank and still have the courage to embark on such a venture is impressive and worth all the encouragement it can get.

*I saw zpz in philadelphia 2006, and it was great.
Well said :!: Dweezil is on a mission to retrieve the time lost when his dad was away from home and communicate with Frank in a parallel univers cuz music is the best for that!! :)

+1 Lumpy. 8)
ZutBof, mission impossible, fer sure! :wink: I like the thought, but I think DZ has his own Zappa legacy going now with the Master Guitar classes, Dweezilla on the road as it were, and it looks like some of the former ZPZ players are in a position to tour with Dweezil separately if he has a mind to. Just sayin' he's proven he's his fathers son on guitar, now the natural flow would be to go with what he knows on his own.
That about right KU? :wink: :mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 4:43 am 
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Is anyone else happy Ahmet got out of the music biz?


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 4:57 am 
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brainpang wrote:
Is anyone else happy Ahmet got out of the music biz?


Well, no, in the sense that I wish he could have done at least one ZPZ tour. Because, you know, well, nah, I won't say it, except to say that maybe there's someone that may not be the most exciting front man, crowd-wise. I hope I'm not being too cryptic.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 12:56 pm 
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cleon wrote:
downer mydnyte wrote:
You can't immerse yourself in playing someone else's music for years and years and then just pop right back and be original. Not possible. Your identity has been submerged. It's going to take a long while before you find your own voice. You've gotta nurture your own vision, right? You can't get away with neglecting it or being a clone.

Music is not Rocket science you said a week ago,then post this Dribble :D


Music is not rocket science. At it's best it's a form of self expression. Copying someone else is not exactly self expression, is it?

If there was no money in it, would DZ spend so much time learning how to play like his dad? Doubtful. That doesn't make him a bad guy. He's just unoriginal and boring. Copying someone great does not make you great. Some of you act as though it's a burden being Zappa's son. It's certainly more of a burden to be the son of a man who didn't leave you anything. DZ had it handed to him. All the notes, the compositions, the tones, the everything. All he had to do was xerox it.

I don't need DZ to keep Frank's legacy alive. FZ's recorded music does that just fine. My statement above does not contradict the fact that music is not rocket science. If you want to listen to inferior versions of Zappa tunes performed by DZ go ahead. I'm not putting you down for it. I happen to think DZ is the worst thing to happen to Zappa music. Nothing personal, I just dislike all of the parasite bands floating around and ZPZ is one of them. All of these cover bands are doing it for money and I see no reason to support that. If they could make as much doing their own stuff they would be doing their own stuff. How can you deny that? These guys all wish they had an audience for their own crap. Take the money out of the equation and you'll see who is really doing it for the love of music. We all need to make money, I am not criticizing that. DZ has the right to live off of his dad's music. It's just that I have no need for a FZ parasite band.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 1:02 pm 
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The man who says "music is not rocket science" obviously never took a harmony course. Also, there's a reason why Ian Underwood said he was happy he'd studied music so he could understand FZ's complex compositions.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 1:08 pm 
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BBP wrote:
The man who says "music is not rocket science" obviously never took a harmony course.

hahaha. Good one.

But seriously....
Harmony is not going to explode and kill people if you make a mistake.

My whole life has been a harmony course. Perhaps you want music to be rocket science, BBP. Maybe it's an ego thing for you.

I happen to know that music is far more important and spiritually nutritious than rocket science.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 1:24 pm 
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downer mydnyte wrote:
....
My whole life has been a harmony course...

I like that statement alot.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 2:21 pm 
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downer mydnyte wrote:
BBP wrote:
The man who says "music is not rocket science" obviously never took a harmony course.

hahaha. Good one.

But seriously....
Harmony is not going to explode and kill people if you make a mistake.

My whole life has been a harmony course. Perhaps you want music to be rocket science, BBP. Maybe it's an ego thing for you.

I happen to know that music is far more important and spiritually nutritious than rocket science.

Whyy. :|

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 7:50 pm 
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downer mydnyte wrote:
You can't immerse yourself in playing someone else's music for years and years and then just pop right back and be original. Not possible. Your identity has been submerged. It's going to take a long while before you find your own voice. You've gotta nurture your own vision, right? You can't get away with neglecting it or being a clone.


That's not necessarily true at all.

downer mydnyte wrote:
If there was no money in it, would DZ spend so much time learning how to play like his dad? Doubtful. That doesn't make him a bad guy. He's just unoriginal and boring. Copying someone great does not make you great. Some of you act as though it's a burden being Zappa's son. It's certainly more of a burden to be the son of a man who didn't leave you anything. DZ had it handed to him. All the notes, the compositions, the tones, the everything. All he had to do was xerox it.

I don't need DZ to keep Frank's legacy alive. FZ's recorded music does that just fine. My statement above does not contradict the fact that music is not rocket science. If you want to listen to inferior versions of Zappa tunes performed by DZ go ahead. I'm not putting you down for it. I happen to think DZ is the worst thing to happen to Zappa music. Nothing personal, I just dislike all of the parasite bands floating around and ZPZ is one of them. All of these cover bands are doing it for money and I see no reason to support that. If they could make as much doing their own stuff they would be doing their own stuff. How can you deny that? These guys all wish they had an audience for their own crap. Take the money out of the equation and you'll see who is really doing it for the love of music. We all need to make money, I am not criticizing that. DZ has the right to live off of his dad's music. It's just that I have no need for a FZ parasite band.


Says the poster who apparently makes a living doing music industry session work in Southern California, yet knocks much of the recordings he's played on. Anyway...

First of all, you can argue with me all day until you're blue in the face as to whether or not Dweezil would be playing FZ's music if there was no money in it. But the fact is, long before ZPZ started, DZ and even Z were playing Peaches En Regalia, Dirty Love, Black Napkins, etc. And if you realized the sheer amount love, passion, will, diligence and determination he's put into playing FZ's music AND considering DZ doesn't make as much money as you probably think, you probably wouldn't be saying the above.

Secondly, like I stated earlier in this thread, Dweezil studied sweep, hybrid and economy picking techniques in order to facilitate his playing abilities so he could pull off guitar arrangements (many of which weren't even written for guitar) of FZ's music for TWO YEARS prior to putting the original ZPZ band together in 2005. So when it comes to DZ playing the music of Frank Zappa, NOTHING was handed to him. Not only that, but if you still think he's unoriginal and boring, you obviously haven't heard his past two solo albums.

And lastly, what you more than obviously don't understand, since you clearly don't have a business mind, is that in terms of net profits, most FZ cover bands make next to nothing from playing FZ's music. They primarily do it for the love of the music.

Btw, I happen to think you're a complete fucking idiot. Nothing personal.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:49 am 
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downer mydnyte wrote:
BBP wrote:
The man who says "music is not rocket science" obviously never took a harmony course.

hahaha. Good one.

But seriously....
Harmony is not going to explode and kill people if you make a mistake.

My whole life has been a harmony course. Perhaps you want music to be rocket science, BBP. Maybe it's an ego thing for you.

I happen to know that music is far more important and spiritually nutritious than rocket science.


DM: as a musicology student I saw many people bite off more than they can chew for harmony. If it was as simple as just defining the notes none of them would have issues, but gathering whether you have a C-minor chord with added 6th or an A-minor 7th chord from the context of the piece, that's where the kicker is. Just because it's not lethal, doesn't mean it's not hard.

And if you have to blame your ignorance on other people's egos, well sorry you've earned a one-way trip to my ignore list. I'm a pleasant person but when people start offending me, that's when they lose all good in my book.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:02 am 
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Did you mean C-Major with added 6th and A-Minor 7th? I am assuming so, because then they would both have the same notes: C E G A ---> A C E G

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 11:44 am 
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The Forum Killed Arkay wrote:
Did you mean C-Major with added 6th and A-Minor 7th? I am assuming so, because then they would both have the same notes: C E G A ---> A C E G

And another thing they named after the root.

Rocket Science is simple now,not a single person is fully responsible idea's from lighting a fire Caveman shit :wink: genius in music i suppose they've had they day as like Downer mydnyte said it is hard too be Original.I say especially if your a rocket scientist :mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 12:20 pm 
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The Forum Killed Arkay wrote:
Did you mean C-Major with added 6th and A-Minor 7th? I am assuming so, because then they would both have the same notes: C E G A ---> A C E G


They'd have the same notes but they don't have the same harmonical meaning. In a C-major musical section, it could be either a I + 6th, or a vi 7. If you have a modulation in a piece (most pieces over 2 minutes do), you'll have to figure out where the modulation happens first, usually around the time of the disputed chord.
Another "fun" chord is the piling of 4 minor thirds, like C E-flat G-flat A. Such a chord can be heard a lot in Bach's infamous Toccata. Now which one of the notes in such a chord is the "ground" note? Hard to tell unless you look at the context, and even then it'll take some head-scratching.

About the most famous harmonical discussion point is the Tristan chord.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 12:44 pm 
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Oh, good, I thought that's what you meant. You had previously written "C-minor" so I wanted to be sure.
Fun that yer learning about "The Devil's Interval", the augmented 4th, which is how I learned about The Tristan Chord. Long before Tristan and Isolde, composers, paid by the royalty, instructed by the church, weren't allowed to include augmented 4th, too devilish, hahaha

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