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PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:29 pm 
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From Tom Brown interview:

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Several months later my roommate wound up having a date with a stewardess he had met in a nightclub, who showed up at our door with a copy of "Freak Out!" under her arm. She told us of having The Mothers of Invention on one her flights and how weird looking, but nice they all were... except for Frank who sat by himself away from the band. She said Jimmy and Roy gave her the record, then graciously arranged to have the entire band sign it at her request... everyone except for Frank. While the passengers were departing at the conclusion of the flight, she stood at the door bidding them adieu with the album under her arm. As Frank was leaving the plane he noticed the album and said "I see you have our album, have you heard our music?" She had to admit that she hadn't, wherein Frank extended his middle finger, stuck it directly in front of her face and exclaimed..."Here's a preview" then sauntered casually down the ramp.


Now, in TRFZB, FZ admits to making the reputation with the early Mothers via insulting the audience. Yet, if you listen to the 1967-69 live recordings, FZ' stage banter does appear to be acerbic and witty, but mostly subtle. There aren't many 1965-66 live recordings. So I have no idea how harsh FZ' stage banter was then. On the other hand, his whole attitude did seem a bit more acidic in 1966. Was he reeling from that illegal '65 entrapment and thus taking out his unresolved anger on all the stewardesses and others? Or did he simply harden his heart and decide to act offensively in order to make a reputation, with the idea that any publicity is good publicity in mind? Or perhaps a bit of both? He certainly was rather apologetic (as in defending, not feeling sorry) about his cynicism when he judged anyone not cynical to be "out of step with the 20th century". Cynicism seemed both a defence mechanism as well as a way to push through and gain success. If the humanity can be divided between those who fight and those who opt for flight, Zappa was certainly a fighter. A true fighter. Perhaps he was a warrior in one of his hypothetical past lives, who knows.

Now what do you think? Was Frank Zappa the kind of person that could be considered an "asshole" and by "asshole" I mean like in the same class as Miles Davis and others: nasty, unpalatable temperament fuelling extraordinary musical talent.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 4:46 pm 
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Let's assign it in the word-of-mouth rumor bin for now.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 5:36 pm 
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I loved the Austin Powers movies. And the first Wayne's World too. My son and I watched it all the time.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 7:57 am 
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Frank was super to his fans and that's all that matters.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:22 am 
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Ed Organus Maximus wrote:
Was Frank Zappa the kind of person that could be considered an "asshole" and by "asshole" I mean like in the same class as Miles Davis and others: nasty, unpalatable temperament fuelling extraordinary musical talent.

In the immortal words of Brian Rivera:"Well, in a way..."

Interesting topic, maybe I'll return when a find a certain interview in the basement. But he loved and was loved by many, so it's not a clear-cut case of nastiness, for sure.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 10:23 am 
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There is an austrian TV-docu about FZ (the one with Rudi Cadillac) that exists in 2 versions. There is a chapter, where alumni were asked about there opinion on FZ. Don Preston said: "I don't like the way he treats people, he's got no heart". When FZ later was seriously ill he phoned them TV-guys again to get in the TV again and they expanded the original docu. The prostata cancer and the YS-project were reported. The statement of Don Preston was removed from this version.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 2:15 pm 
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Everybody has a bad day or for what ever reason doesn't feel like being nice and polite, while not a requirerment it makes things go much smoother... :smoke:


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 3:23 pm 
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FZ's behavior - and moreover the opinion of people who only saw him a few minutes/hours - cannot be that important.
This guy was so much a hard worker that only his works and music do make sense.
Sorry, but to me this topic's title kinda sounds like "How good was FZ as a cook?" or "WWFZD?" If you see what I mean?
Although the question might be legitimate, and I am sure people will likely post interesting testimonies and quotes here, you will never know whether you would have liked to have him as a guest for a drink or dinner.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 4:19 pm 
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My point was that Mike Myers is supposed to be a pain to work with and can be an ass. I really don't give a shit. This thread smacks of "celebrity gossip". I don't listen to and enjoy his music because he's a nice guy, or mean, or arrogant, or anything.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 1:53 pm 
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calvin2hikers wrote:
My point was that Mike Myers is supposed to be a pain to work with and can be an ass. I really don't give a shit. This thread smacks of "celebrity gossip". I don't listen to and enjoy his music because he's a nice guy, or mean, or arrogant, or anything.



Dude TMZ is one of the funniest shows on TV... :smoke:


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 3:51 pm 
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He was a bit dickish here..... Entirely justifiable though.......

http://youtu.be/2IZFrlJx4U4

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 4:26 pm 
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Plook wrote:
calvin2hikers wrote:
My point was that Mike Myers is supposed to be a pain to work with and can be an ass. I really don't give a shit. This thread smacks of "celebrity gossip". I don't listen to and enjoy his music because he's a nice guy, or mean, or arrogant, or anything.



Dude TMZ is one of the funniest shows on TV... :smoke:


Wow, really? That's a horrible show. A bunch of people sitting around belittling celebrities because they think they're "better" human beings? I couldn't sit through one minute of that shit.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 5:01 pm 
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calvin2hikers wrote:
Plook wrote:
calvin2hikers wrote:
My point was that Mike Myers is supposed to be a pain to work with and can be an ass. I really don't give a shit. This thread smacks of "celebrity gossip". I don't listen to and enjoy his music because he's a nice guy, or mean, or arrogant, or anything.



Dude TMZ is one of the funniest shows on TV... :smoke:


Wow, really? That's a horrible show. A bunch of people sitting around belittling celebrities because they think they're "better" human beings? I couldn't sit through one minute of that shit.



Its a comedy the 3 guys in the back row are the writers, your watching it wrong, watch it as a comedy... :idea:


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 5:07 pm 
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Plook wrote:
Its a comedy the 3 guys in the back row are the writers, your watching it wrong, watch it as a comedy... :idea:


No. Shit is shit.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 7:16 pm 
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calvin2hikers wrote:
Plook wrote:
Its a comedy the 3 guys in the back row are the writers, your watching it wrong, watch it as a comedy... :idea:


No. Shit is shit.

Got to agree with Calvin on this one. It's television's equivalent of the National Enquirer and all those other crap magazines at the checkout line.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 9:54 pm 
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KUIII wrote:
calvin2hikers wrote:
Plook wrote:
Its a comedy the 3 guys in the back row are the writers, your watching it wrong, watch it as a comedy... :idea:


No. Shit is shit.

Got to agree with Calvin on this one. It's television's equivalent of the National Enquirer and all those other crap magazines at the checkout line.

+1

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 4:56 am 
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sorry, I don't trust people who claim to be above a little gossip.

that said, gripes between PEERS is an entirely different animal than amongst the general public.
too much jealousy involved to pay any heed.

also, musicians tend to suck as human beings so I generally try to avoid personal contact. they solely exist for my amusement and any first hand contact may jeopardize that.

ps I HATE celeb gossip teevee shows. that TMZ guy has done more to promote anti-semitism than Hitler.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 4:10 am 
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I listened to an FZ audio documentary called Air Sculpture on Youtube today and Tommy Mars mentioned how ruthless Frank was. When Steve Vai was first on tour with him he made a few mistakes during a filmed rehearsal and Frank apparently ripped him to shreds and wouldn't lay off of him. Claiming he isn't ready for the road.

I have seen interviews where Frank was difficult but usually because the interviewer is asking the same dumb boring questions and hasn't a clue on what FZ is about.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 5:34 am 
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NuclearProstate wrote:
I have seen interviews where Frank was difficult but usually because the interviewer is asking the same dumb boring questions and hasn't a clue on what FZ is about.

I feel like that has a lot more to do with his alleged "nastiness" than most people give credit. It must have gotten really boring to tell people for twenty-seven continuous years that you don't approve of recreational drug use (and even still there are no shortage of people who assume Frank was "up to his eyebrows in chemical refreshment." Some of my own personal friends to this day hold the silly belief that he was lying through his teeth when he said he's "straight."

Now, is it really a big deal whether or not he uses drugs? Is it really a big deal whether or not he smoked cigarettes? Is it really a big deal whether or not he slept around? I'd answer each of those three questions (and any variation thereof) with a resounding "not really," but it's still interesting to know; having more information about an individual's personal life (to the extent that they don't mind sharing, I don't know that much about FZ that I haven't heard come out of his mouth or read from his quotes) makes it far easier for me to try and understand just where it is he was coming from when he wrote and recorded songs like "Disco Boy" and "Ms Pinky" on the same album as "Black Napkins" and "Zoot Allures," (kind of complete opposite ends of the spectrum) or when he wrote a thirty-minute comedy-rock epic about a mountain named Billy. I can wrap my head around those concepts a bit more easily when I think about the fact that he wasn't just an incredibly creative and inspired man, but he was a man who thought of himself as "an entertainer" who ultimately just wanted to have a good time.

But back to my original point, the fairly common belief that FZ was kind of a jerk to a lot of people definitely has a lot to do with the countless people he met, be it talk-show hosts, rock journalists, other musicians, or just plain old guys from California who simply didn't get him because they didn't take the time to read more than one article that gave them a conflated view of his music, his contemporaries in music and his own personal attitudes. I know it would really wear on my nerves :smoke:

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 7:27 am 
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If you are doing an interview run and doing 6-7 a day for 2-3 weeks you're going to get fucked off being asked the same questions over and over again. You can see when a good debate or interesting questions come up he lights up and speaks and engages. He will fucking destroy a crap interviewer though and he gets delight in it.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 6:44 pm 
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He was once interviewed by Grace Slick, back in the 80's I guess. He made her just miserable. :)

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 9:26 pm 
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I saw that on YouTube, but they were both a little miserable due to the crowd of idiots behind them being incredibly rude. He wasn't being nasty to her, but she was asking the usual 60's queries. He did seem to be happy to see her. Maybe there was another interview with her I missed...she never mentioned it in her book, she did not suffer fools gladly, so you know she would have said what an ass he had been. Although, one of my favorite quotes from someone about Frank came from her, "He's the most intelligent asshole I've ever met." Hmmm....

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 11:41 pm 
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If you say he's a nasty little man on DZW you'll be banned like Pope Jim was.

He was a nice guy who didn't take no shit from anyone trying to use him. 8)

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 7:50 am 
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He was a huge control freak when he got down to business, so I believe in that respect he probably was nasty but other than that I will never know what he was like personally so you can only judge by what you read I guess. But even if he was a huge asshole control freak nastiest man in the world that's not going to prevent me from being a big fan and respecting him a lot :mrgreen:


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 3:12 pm 
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dove_grey wrote:
"He's the most intelligent asshole I've ever met."


It's like my boss always says. I'm only a cunt to people I think are cunts. I'll never miss dickheads, never ever ever.

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