the forum killed arkay wrote:
...I really want to stay away from using Opera ...
... So, if we change Themes every few seconds and each theme has little to nothing to do with adjacent themes, then we no longer have an evolution, but randomness...The Randomness is limited by the Composition, indeed must be secondary to the Composition.
All these concepts were utilized by FZ in his compositions at times...
...But, the individual events of Greggary or BTM often act independently of the rest of the composition, even if they do still relate to CC. I suppose it is only logical that in order for there to be integrity of CC, then individual compositions MUST play a secondary role to CC, as a subset of CC...
good thread; just to get on the same page, do these qualify as large-format compositions: thick as a brick, supper's ready & close to the edge ¿¿ rather than the rock opera [aka concept album] tommy
on random compositional technique, if themes change every few seconds, but in a somewhat consistent pattern, the randomization becomes secondary to the composition, the listener can anticipate and comprehend the theme changes ... in approximate; zappa's random note sequences played for random lengths of time & tied together by solos loses it's randomness as long as the random pattern is continued
That's why I say more modular.as unclemeat69 noted a couple of times, zappa used modules to build songs ... there was a vinnie interview/clinic where he says zappa had blocks to be inserted at strategic points in songs, also during umrk rehearsals zappa would direct band members to cue-in these numbered pre-rehearsed modules; he didn't call them modules, or loops, but same concept
arkay, you're saying btm or gp are an assembly of well-known pieces interwoven with cc, agreed; are there any monster zappa songs that go beyond extended jams and have minimal conceptual continuity ¿
let's put thingfish back on the table; ok, it re-engages songs from 3 or 4 of his older albums, so it can't stand-alone, but almost ¾ of the material is unique to thingfish and in addition to the story, the thingfish format is consistent through all songs ... this one is extra-large
how about the ocean is the ultimate solution ¿ it's a monster composition, not a lot of cc, stands alone more or less, and has several distinct parts woven together; the intro, acoustic section, twangy bridge section, bass solo, bass solo with acoustic guitar, electric guitar solo with & without acoustic guitar, the outro